00:00:12,770	Well. All, Right? We will, uh, we will This month’s meeting of the burly county Planning and Zoning Commission. Uh, we’ll start with roll call. So Marla, if you could take us through that. OK? Comm. Bittner. Yeah. Comm. Jarrett. Monsieur Marquardt here. Comm. Monson. Yes. Comm. Patrick here. Comm. Schmidt Comm. streifel here. Comm. Zaroff. Nope.

00:00:55,570	And, Mr Chair. We have eight OK, we have a We have a quorum and we will move into the approval of the April Minutes. Move to approve as presented. I OK it’s been moved by mayor Schmitz and seconded by Comm. Munson to approve the minutes as presented. Um Comm. to roll call vote on this. Yes. OK.

00:01:26,500	Thank you That’s what you want. OK, Um to approve the minutes Comm. Bittner. Yes, Comm., Jared. Mr marquardt? Yes. Comm. munson, Comm. Patrick Comm. Schmidt Comm. streifel. And Chair. Yes. OK. The minutes have been approved. As presented. And moving into the K consent agenda. We don’t have anything on the consent agenda.

00:02:02,830	Uh, we’ll move into the public hearings portion of this so moving into, uh, item 43 Burn Creek Farm. Special use permit. Continuation. Um Mitch. Can you give us a little more detail to, uh, kind of remind us where we’re at. Good evening commissioners, Mr. Chair. Um We’re at a continuance of the April 10th public hearing.

00:02:28,500	The applicant pulled that, um Appeal on April 10th meeting and this board decided to forward this public hearing to the tonight The applicant again pulled his information He didn’t want to present anything at this meeting. Um, so it’s It would be my recommendation. To. You could open the public hearing. That’s fine, but I wouldn’t take any public testimony.

00:02:53,030	I believe that we’re at the end of, uh The application process for this without an applicant here. To, uh, present any new information. I think we Pretty. Much know everybody’s sentiment on And they are here, so it would be my recommendation not to take testimony and to deny the permit application. And.

00:03:17,100	He could appeal that to the county commission. All, right? Are there any questions for mitch? I have a question? Yes. Go ahead. Can. You tell us why why it was pulled or do you have any further information You want to consult with his attorney? OK? All right. Thank you any other questions for mitch while he’s up here? My question.

00:03:42,230	It’s been an advertised public meeting and we don’t have a public meeting. But What does that Well. What are you gonna talk about Yeah, we’re gonna be a dead horse here. I mean it’s the the he’s not here. There’s I don’t know if there’s anybody here that’s in support of it.

00:04:00,430	It’s not that we don’t want to stop anybody from talking. But we’ve had Multiple meetings on the stakeholder meeting groups. We’ve had public hearings on this. We’ve had the appeal at the county commission on this and so we kind of know where we’re at. And. I’m not sure that You know if it’s it’s up to you.

00:04:16,970	You guys wanna have a public hearing? Open it up for testimony. That’s fine with me. I just I just want to make sure that since it was an advertised meeting, do we have to follow through with that, or are we OK to not have one? That’s all I’m asking. Mr Chair. I could Yes Comm. Bettner? Yes.

00:04:34,970	I think if there’s any public in the room that responded to a public notice where public hearing and we could hear what they have to say, and then we can close the public hearing and decide what we want to do. Thank you that way? Yeah that way we accommodate anybody. That’s in the room that did want to speak.

00:04:50,730	And. Oh, yes, a Comm. shale. We’re gonna be moving into a public. Um, yes, yes, absolutely. And, then feel free to stay seated at the table if you’d like, Uh, if you Up to you? Yes. Uh so I think we will move into this? Uh we will, uh I. Guess.

00:05:11,300	We’re not gonna really open it because the the the, uh, hearing is open already. We will just, uh, move into taking any public comment. That is, uh, relevant, uh, that maybe things we haven’t heard before. Uh, if anyone would like to speak, Uh, the hearing is now is now open and, uh, please feel free to approach the microphone.

00:05:33,230	Uh, announce your name where you’re from, and Sign in if you are going to speak And. This is a hearing for the Burnt Creek farm special use permit. Anyone like to speak on the Burnt Creek farm Special use permit hearing. Commissioners Marcus Hall, Bernon engineer. I just wanted to point out something to the commission here.

00:06:02,030	And if you want to have some discussion afterwards, and, um, if this thing moves forward, make a recommendation to the county board, um, at one of the options that we’re looking at was different, Uh, issues as far as like dust control, and in the recommendation it was willing to share the cost of dust control while sharing the

00:06:19,200	cost. I don’t know what that means, in the sense is that 5050 is at 9010. Is it $1? So some discussion and maybe a recommendation to the county board might be a good way to go. And. I do think that the other item is willing to share the cost of road maintenance.

00:06:38,300	They’re two different things there. Um, Dust Control is a pretty straightforward, pretty defined cost thing. Road maintenance could be a huge number. That could be a million dollars in that may not be a 5050 kind of thing. That may be something less so I, um, would appreciate just some. Maybe some discussion some thoughts.

00:06:56,570	And that something that you can pass along? Make a recommendation to the county board on so OK, uh, would you I guess, do you have it on the top of your head? What is what is dust control cost generally speaking. What we the number we’re using lately is about $10,000 a mile. Ok, OK, so Fantastic. Thank you. I. I.

00:07:18,530	Guess I should have asked. Are there. Are there any questions from the board? Hearing. None. If. There’s anyone else that would like to approach the lectern and speak Hi. I’m Dana Fleck I live on, Uh 3566 1/10 Avenue Northeast When you were visiting about the, um Cost share on the desk control and the road maintenance.

00:07:47,200	We did not agree to any of that. So. I’m Not sure if you’re under the impression that we are OK with that or not We’re not. I’m not my husband’s not and our neighbors aren’t because that is not our event, nor should we have to have, um, responsibility for providing money for that.

00:08:08,570	I did send an email and I’m sure you’ve all had had a chance to read it. OK so my feelings and thoughts are there if you have any questions I’m available for that. Are there any questions? OK. Thank you? No, thank you. Ver. Sign my name, right? Yes. Please do If anyone else would like to approach and, uh and speak.

00:08:32,930	Please do Good Evening Commission. My name is Sheila Zucker. I live at 27 02 Kent Drive, Um in Bismarck that is just off of 26th Street. Um I’m within the two mile radius of that circular and I just want it to be known that I was never notified via, um, the notification process, which is

00:09:07,300	by certified mail is my understanding from where I worked previously. Um some of my concerns on this is the fact that he has withdrawn. Um Application or postponed, withheld his application to the next time period. How many times does he get to withhold And have all of us come out here.

00:09:30,770	To try to get support in denying this When. I purchased that property out there seven years ago, I purchased it for peace and serenity. And. I am in the four K estates, and I know that Dave schmitz has provided a letter with regard to many of the residents in our neighborhood and we are not in support of this.

00:09:55,930	It’s Not that I don’t approve. Agricultural purposes, but I think that this is beyond that. I don’t want a wedding venue in my backyard. Um, when I purchase that I can hear, you know. I can hear the gun club clear as day at my property. And the gun club is farther away than his property.

00:10:18,330	And I want my peace and serenity And. I just think that the notification process really needs to truly be looked into on this because we are two houses away from 26th Street. And, I guess, Um, I. Do not look for any kind of support on this at all. So. I just wanted my voice to be heard.

00:10:39,600	And, um For, those other people out there and from what I hear. Is he able without this special use permit. Is he able to have events currently out there. That’s my question to you. And who is watching that and who is going to monitor his activities out there? That’s what I question. Thank you? Thank you are.

00:11:00,130	Are there any questions for Sheila? Do. I sign this one, too. If. I already signed the other one. Yeah. Yeah, if you could. Thank you, thank you. Uh, I guess I don’t know, Mitch. I don’t know if you want to, uh, maybe field that question or if there’s uh maybe someone else better to answer that question.

00:11:16,630	We could do that after the public meeting. OK, OK. Thank you. Oh, Do want to clear? Uh, Mr? Uh, Mr Chair, Mrs. I do want to clear up the, um The Um, maybe the the misunderstanding of the shared cost of dust control. That was a suggestion from Mr Lehman.

00:11:45,230	During one of the meetings of the stakeholders groups is to Share the cost between the neighbors for birth control. OK? Thank you much as far as Events, per, uh, it Yeah. Nobody can have an event. That’s a commercial, Uh, commercial event that he’s charging money on their private property.

00:12:10,470	They have to be permitted from, uh Burly county They they can as long as they’re not selling alcohol. Or shooting fireworks. Uh, anybody can have a party. So. It’s one of them deals until it gets out of hand and the sheriff they call the sheriffs on him or whatever.

00:12:28,800	What you’re saying is a Yeah just to clarify as long as they’re not charging, Uh, the the landowners not charging admission, selling alcohol or shooting off fireworks. Yeah for money. Yeah. It’s, It’s in Commercialization is proper is not allowed. As in an agricultural zone. Neither is selling alcohol or shooting fireworks. I mean? Yeah. The big display fireworks thanks for the clarification.

00:12:55,900	All right if there’s anyone else who would like to speak, uh, at this public hearing? Please come forward. Good Evening Commissioners, Uh, case probably know me by now, Um, Kurt Fleck. I live up there on 35 6600 and 10th Avenue northeast Bismarck.

00:13:31,570	Um And heavily involved in this as you guys know, And? Uh uh, very frustrating that we can waste our time like we are, and, uh, when a guy pulls his, uh, app and doesn’t notify anyone, and we show up again, you know, And. Uh uh. This has got to come to a head. You guys apologized a few meetings ago about not having an ordinance in place and everything. Do. We have an ordinance in place, Mitch. Are.

00:13:47,030	We voting on an ordinance or where are we at with that? Uh, there there is. No there is no ordinance in place right now. OK, so we’re two years in running without it, you know, So. I mean at some point Um Somebody’s got to explain or I I don’t understand. How. This continues to run down the road.

00:14:03,570	We’re going to continue to have chaos in the county and everywhere else. I’m not just talking 110th Avenue. We don’t have policies and ordinances in place. We set a precedent, right? And. We’re going to let him set a precedent or wherever it is, and then we’re gonna be back Dog fighting again.

00:14:18,270	I mean, if that’s OK, I’ll just go build what I need to build right now and not worry about a thing, right? I mean? I know you guys are all laughing, But. It’s true because my my thing is up there, too.

00:14:30,870	And, Uh, I’m Gonna Just go build homes and not worry about storm water or anything else, right, Casey? See Casey and, uh, Marcus Cerda gave me the thumbs up on it. I know monsters laughing about it. Hey, that’s where we’re at, right? I mean? Come on guys. Uh, we need to, uh, we need to get off the pot. Get.

00:14:50,030	An ordinance in places is not difficult put the ordinance in place issue special use permits when they’re required, and, uh and move on. So And. That’s My Point Any Questions for Kurt. Fire steps away. You guys have all got emails from me. More than happy to answer any questions. CNN. Thanks Kurt. Thanks for your time. Anyone else. Uh, like to speak in this, uh, hearing of the Burn Creek farm special use permit. Cher agnew and commissioners.

00:15:19,330	Uh my name is B streifel. I was not gonna speak, but I think I’m letting my neighbors kind of carry load here And, so I wanted to share some information that that I think you’ll appreciate as facts. Uh, Marla, can I show anything on this? Um, monitor here.

00:15:39,300	It sh It should be your should be ready, OK? Ah, I want to thank all of you for taking the time whether it’s through reading email or listening to testimony for those, uh, from those of us who are affected by this Burnt Creek, you special farm a special use permit if it’s approved and how would be affected.

00:15:56,870	So the first time this special use permit came in front of the Planning and Zoning Commission. I was opposed based on procedure. My goal in speaking tonight is to share some facts with the commission. As. I believe consideration of this type of a permit is an ongoing situation and we Be dealing with it again in the near future.

00:16:14,900	The applicant, Mr Lehman purchased the 31 acre property in 2019. Shortly. Thereafter he applied for a tourism grant from the North Dakota Department of AG and received $88,125 for and I quote the first stage of incorporating a cry with pizzeria and event space. And a. You pick Orchard.

00:16:42,170	So, the A PU, the agricultural products utilization funds were used for a site and orchard development consultant fees for site design and facility analysis and AD, a compliant guest restroom facilities. In 2023.

00:17:09,400	Mr Lehman applied for another grant from the North Dakota Department of commerce for $635,300 that application states that te uh the taxpayer money if received will be used for a barn and silo restoration, as well as construction of a new building to be used to offer an indoor event space and to this date that money has not been received by the applicant as of now.

00:17:27,170	But the wording in the governor’s press release on November 6th of 2023 is at the North Dakota Department of commerce will continue to work with all of the applicants for funds to support new offerings for visitors across North Dakota, so it’s still it’s still on the docket to receive funds. So.

00:17:46,900	The reason for bringing this to the commission’s attention is to show an intent for this property to be used as a large event venue, including future plans to build an event building. This is concerning to the neighbor, neighboring properties and for good reason, one of which is in the applicant’s own words, as he testified at a public hearing on July of 2020 in opposition to a property owner that’s located directly south of him.

00:18:05,430	He spoke to the fact that there’s only one way in and one way out and he did not want emergency vehicles turning around in his yard. Because in the past, a garbage truck got stuck and it took a pay loader to pull it out.

00:18:19,970	And so I would just add to that if emergency vehicles come to this area, they will need to turn around on his property or on mine. So here is a Google earth picture of this area. Well That doesn’t look so great. Oh, There. You can see. There’s only one way in and one way out. Uh, this This is Right. Here is the property. Right here is his property.

00:19:05,270	110th and 41st are narrow gravel roads with steep ditches and soft spots where hay creek flows underneath. We recently had an emergency on the corner of 41st and 100 and 10th. Uh, two sheriff vehicles of fire truck, a utility truck and there’s very little room to get in and out of there. If. There’s any type of emergency or accident. Uh, recently.

00:19:30,230	I’m Sure You Guys know the Highway department’s been out on 100 and 10 cutting down dead and dying trees. There were several hours on a couple of separate days where property owners who lived east of the trucks where the trucks were working.

00:19:46,930	Those roads were shut down and the people couldn’t get to and from their homes. So. A couple of vehicles came down the 41st section line, which is North of Our property, my property and and, uh, Mr Layman’s And that’s that’s the section line that goes to the North. That’s the only way to get in and out of this property. These properties if 100 and 10th is blocked Well.

00:20:09,770	Two vehicles got stuck while the highway department was removing the trees, and it took a skid steer to pull one of them out, and it left a heck of a mess. So. It’s easy to see why people are going to be concerned about accessing their property during an emergency or inclement weather.

00:20:27,370	If a traffic congestion becomes an issue. But. This property is also surrounded by dead and dying trees, and there’s a large pile of dead trees directly across Directly caught across the section line from neighboring properties with the recent winds if a cigarette is tossed out by someone during an event, a prairie fire is a valid concern, especially with Winds

00:20:51,970	like we’ve been experiencing recently and during a neighborhood stakeholder meeting, the question was asked of a rural fire of the rural fire chief assistant who was in attendance who is responsible for a wedding attendee throws out a cigarette and starts a fire. And The neighbors were told. Well you attorneys will battle it out.

00:21:10,870	And and that just doesn’t sound like a good time. For some reason, even though the apparent intent of Mr Lehman, the owner of Burn Creek Farm was to construct an event building Burnt Creek farm was not required to plot the property.

00:21:28,900	Zoning ordinances require the property to be platted if the property owner intends to build on his property. The exception to this is if the property is zoned a agricultural and the building is used for AG purposes. So far a guest house with AD, a restrooms has been built a commercial deck with a handicap ramp was added to the barn and two additional buildings have been moved onto the property. Mr.

00:21:46,500	Lehman has already held events, including filming of a movie, a movie premiere event or tickets were sold. Food trucks, a car show along with a band and a movie that played late into the night. He should have been required to apply for Be granted and then comply with a special use permit for both of those situations.

00:22:05,130	So agri tourism is a word that we’re going to be hearing a lot of and we’ve we’ve been hearing a lot of it recently and I want to make it clear that the neighbors were supportive of what Mister Lamon wanted to do with Burnt Creek Farm. Until. We learned the full details and the larger scope of his plan.

00:22:21,100	We’re not opposed to smaller educational ag related tours and or like nursing home residents coming out and touring or enjoying a picnic. We didn’t mind when Uh, Mr.

00:22:39,030	Lehman threw an all staff picnic for his co workers from the North Dakota Department of Commerce and some of us even attended the end of the rope movie premiere. However. We never have supported the plan for this property to be used to host weddings or anniversaries or large corporate events. Most importantly, since this is the first time application of its kind in burly county, we urge caution.

00:23:03,300	Before authorizing approval to a special use permit for activities that go beyond the definition of purpose of an agritourism. De, uh, de designation in summary agritourism as divine defined by the north Quarter Department of commerce suggest utilizing this zoning regulation for the purposes of education and to supplement income for the property owner does not fall within those definitions and hosting larger events for a fee clearly falls within Zon.

00:23:28,500	Commercial zoning or PUD regulations. And personally. Unless cows are getting married. I don’t think it’s AG tourism. I don’t think Wedding venues are egg tourism. In closing the neighborhood in this area would be adversely affected by anything that goes beyond the agritourism definition that the North Dakota Department of commerce uses.

00:23:52,430	And I respectfully request that the commissioners abide by their previous vote to deny this special use permit. Thank you for your time. Is there any questions for B? Thank you, Bee. If. Anyone else would like to speak. Uh, please approach the lectern. Anyone else like to speak with the burn Creek Farms, uh, special use permit.

00:24:27,630	For one last call of anyone to speak, uh, regarding the Birch Creek farm special use permits. Right, Seeing. No interest. We will close the public hearing. And move into discussion and action on this special use permit. Move to deny the special use permit. Pursuant to the applicant playing his application. Alright has been moved by Comm. Marquart seconded by Comm.

00:24:57,130	Patrick to deny the special use permit. And Marla if you could take us. Oh. Excuse me? Yes, Uh we’ll move into discussion on the motion. Yes. Chair if I can, Um, Mitch explain a little bit more about What Mr Lehman can do on that property without a permit, and I understand.

00:25:22,270	The biggest thing is that he can’t charge for anything. And because that when you charge for an event that becomes commercial His property is AG. But. We cannot if he decides to host the Cub scouts out there at a in a for an overnight camping event. That’s nothing that we can control. Correct. Um, commissioners, Mr. Chair. Uh, Comm. munson.

00:25:50,900	Um There’s not many things that require permits from burly county. The auditor can issue permits for shooting fireworks. Or lottery ticket tennis sales. Um I mean, you can’t If. You want to sell out serve and sell alcohol is another one. So. That’s about the only three that I know that require a permit. If.

00:26:14,400	He wants to host. Uh A family get together, I would say that’s a party. A Private party is not charging for that. That’s You know the public No. I don’t say that it would be open to the public type deal. If. It’s a private event.

00:26:38,500	I That’d be questionable on To have like a Cub Scout group, or, uh, I. You know I, don’t I, I. You’re getting into something that If. It’s not on a regular basis. Why, Why, would it need to be changed to zoning or or raised to a level of a special use permit? I guess.

00:26:57,900	Part of my comment is We have been very specific with the residents that that this is not going. The permit is going to be denied. But. What I don’t want Is your office getting flooded with, you know there’s a camper parked out there. Uh, what are you gonna do about it? Um, or the Cub Scouts are staying out there. What, Are you II.

00:27:14,230	I wanna make sure that we’re clear with the residents that We understand, and we we We understand their concern, and we don’t want this to happen, But. I don’t want you to be overwhelmed, either with A Group of calls, and so if we can explain it a little bit better and make sure the residents understand.

00:27:32,470	The motion has been made to deny the permit. But, you know He can have the Cub Scouts out. For an overnight event. He can, uh, have some friends over for whatever event but as long as he’s not charging for it, there’s really nothing. We As Burle County can do.

00:27:58,070	In that situation, so As much as I feel for the residents, and I and I appreciate their concern, and I want to make sure we do right by them. I. Don’t wanna overload your office or the sheriff’s office with a group of calls. So the better we can educate today and explain that. I think that helps. Indeed. It’s a good question.

00:28:17,770	We’ve had we had, uh, one of the neighbors, uh, called me earlier today that there he’s apparently having a party out there tonight that they’re pulling in campers and Large large amount of people are showing up for tonight. Maybe it might be a camping event this weekend. Um Does. He need a permit for that. I would say no, it’s not on a regular basis.

00:28:36,500	It’s not a continuance of of Another event after another event after another event. Where it’s and it’s not a commercial event. It’s not commercializing his property. I would say that that Unless he Unless it comes into a nuisance complaint or noise complaint or a light? Uh, lights at night kind of deal, Or, um, I.

00:28:59,470	Don’t, you know, got congestion on the on the Road. The safety aspect. Fire aspect. I don’t I don’t know if Briley County can do anything or or would do anything because it’s you know, property right owners have their property for a reason. They have large prob, You know large parties out there have reunions.

00:29:19,170	They have groups of people come up, so it’s kind of like we’re not really county is not You know? Overview this type of thing. What are you doing out there now? Kind of deal. It’s right any other any other discussion or questions? Yeah Comm. Marquardt Chair commissioners Mitch.

00:29:39,370	I drove that road last night because I wanted to see what it was like when it was wet and sloppy and it is horrible at that time, and I had I’ve driven on gravel roads, my whole life and that was that was one That was, um Very unique as far as some of the the steeper ditches.

00:29:59,700	But, then you know the the kind of the hairpin turn there if you’re not paying attention, and, um, just the different, you know, ruts and everything else that we were in that road and I tried going as slow as I could so I didn’t help contribute to that, but I couldn’t imagine Poland, a bunch of campers and stuff on

00:30:17,300	that road today, even as far as what that road looked like last night, so and I didn’t even run on 100 and 10th. From 26 to highway 83 Just because there was I had bought had enough of Um, it needed a good wash Afterwards. I can tell you that.

00:30:37,270	But as far as the the road conditions themselves, I mean that was, you know it was doable, but I, I can see where the residents that live in that area would have some major concerns with, um, just the amount of traffic in some of those areas, especially when the road is wet and and sloppy like that, Uh, D.

00:30:52,730	Of course I haven’t gone up there in quite a few years when it’s been been dry, but You know I wanted to make sure that uh, yesterday was a good time to to go to see the worst case scenario, so and that’s that’s what it was.

00:31:09,100	You’d have to be very careful and then also, uh, make sure that you are driving even below the posted speed limit in that area. Otherwise. You’d very easily end up in the ditch with, uh, the road conditions that that were Uh, yeah. Comm. Schmitz. You had a motion, so it’s probably a follow up on Comm.

00:31:30,030	Munson’s because I think clarity is very important to this one way or the other. And. So Comm. Munson specifically asked the question if this individual is charging Attendees. Is that now commercialized.

00:31:50,770	I don’t care if it’s once Or 10 times in a year because I think an enforcement action is the concern, and if the only way we can have an enforcement action is to have a special use permit, then we got a whole different issue here that needs to be addressed, or we need a different ordinance, which is a Another topic, and that becomes my concern for these residents, because how do how do we protect their property? Mr chair? Yes, Comm., Uh Schmidt, mayors.

00:32:12,630	Um, in the first hour in the first paragraph of article, 11, you’ll see the, um, introduction of the AG district will will specifically say that you could not commercialize agricultural property. Period. I can get them is that under the An existing ordinance or is that a new ordinance that we’re looking at? And Mitch, she said. That’s article 11 correct.

00:33:01,830	Uh, Section one article 13 Section one. The, A AG district is established as a district in which the principal use of land is for general agricultural use. The regulations are intended to prohibit commercial and industrial usage of the land. Period so we don’t have legal counsel here for an interpretation. Like. My question is, What does that mean? One time. If.

00:33:26,900	One time is a violation, then I think there is a way that a complaint can be filed. Or lodged. Which, which I would say. I suspect these residents are looking for some methodology for that to occur if I’m mis Dating. I’m Sorry, but I see that as one of the issues here.

00:33:47,630	Well, first, you’d have to prove that he’s charging. It’s It’s. There’s money being transacted. I underst understand you’d have to get me out there while he’s doing it. And so it’s it’s these things are I mean, if we know there’s there’s something like this going on. We obviously will go out and look at it. And you know, it’s it’s a case by case basis.

00:34:08,170	I understand. I’m just trying to get clarity and also help The citizens. Right. Right I. I think it was around the what is the definition of commercial right is is is charging at any point whether it’s once or 100 times. Is that commercial, right and I and I would I would interpret it as that. Yes. Once.

00:34:27,100	Uh, Comm., patrick, you had a question. I don’t have a question. I just wanted to point out. Uh, Comm. Markwardt pointed out that the 110th is very muddy and and I. I would agree. I’ve driven that prior to the previous meeting.

00:34:45,670	And, 100 and 10th is is not a very good road to travel on when it’s wet. And. Uh Comm. streifel mentioned to be streifel mentioned that traveling north on the sex line. It was impassable.

00:35:05,170	Also, I just wanted to point out that I drove have have driven or tried to drive the sex lane going south from 100 and 10th between 100 and 10th and 97th, and that’s today it would be totally impassable. So. Really. There is absolutely no second. We are of that place. Thank you. Alright any other, Uh, discussion. Any other discussion. Right hearing none. We’ll move into a roll call vote, Marla, if you could take us through that The. Um, motion is to deny the special use permit.

00:35:39,830	Uh yes Vote means you agree with the motion A no vote means You don’t All right, um Comm. S? Yes. Comm. Bittner. Yes. Comm. Jarrett. Comm. monton Yes. Comm. Patrick? Yes. Comm. marquardt. Yes. And Chair. Yes. 124567 Alright, uh, motion passes to deny the special use permit for Burn Creek Farm. That Is the end of our public hearings for the evening.

00:36:22,500	Uh, we will move into other business. And. Uh, yes. Uh uh, Comm. streifel, Uh, Welcome back. I appreciate you recusing yourself in this in the, uh, previous matter, uh, other business we have Article eight, talking about Article eight section 28 that would be Agricultural Recreation Ordinance. Mr Chair. Commissioners, Um Ordinances are not easy to create.

00:36:49,230	Especially when you have a lot of people at the table. And. A lot of concerns. We. Don’t we do not want to make mistakes when we create an ordinance. Um, it’s A. Very a very fine needle. It has to be threaded. On an Article eight section 28 for agricultural, uh, agritourism.

00:37:14,300	Um, there have been requests in the past from from peoples and organizations to to, um, intending to use private land for agricultural recreation. And others to educate about it. Agriculture, or agricultural practices and activities. The. These requests may seem uncomplicated. They may seem easy.

00:37:43,700	But the effect on neighboring properties, infrastructure, emergency responders, et cetera, could be considerable, considerable as a threshold of commercial uses, considered by some marginal Some people look at this as commercial use of agricultural land. Some people look at it as a saving of a savior to, uh, agricultural property farms.

00:38:08,770	Um and they’re Uh so we’re we’re gonna a fine line of what we should be approving what we should be reviewing the, um Therefore on this. This Ordinance 24 preliminary draft ordinance we have had I sent, uh, Marla sent you guys. Um New document today has has different sections on it. These are, um, suggestions from the stakeholder groups. And from the department of Commerce. Uh, Uh, a, uh, department of their tourism.

00:38:37,570	On this document if you can find it in your packets, the the highlighted yellow with red letters or the suggested changes that I’ve made. The Light Blue color is suggestions from the stakeholder groups. And, the red, Uh, lettered areas are suggestions from The Department of, uh uh Tourism. There have been some significant changes.

00:39:07,500	One of the one of my suggested changes is to remove The third tier, uh, agricultural recreation. Uh, completely from the ordinance. And this is the This is where they was going to be allowing for event centers, corporate events. That sort of thing. Um, that I I honestly believe should be a separate special use permit totally different than the agricultural tourism.

00:39:34,730	Um, either through special use perimeter or PUD. We have one on the docket for next month that is an event center. That’s that’s going through the PUD zoning. Application. Now, and that would not necessarily require rezoning. Is that correct the event center or no, A PUDAPUD is rezoning. OK OK Sorry Sorry, But. It’s. It’s I.

00:39:59,700	I. Personally, I would prefer a special use for this because you can define absolutely define that, but you can also define it in by the site plan by by everything that that they wanna do, is written down in a PD on the narrative and on the site plan, right, I.

00:40:16,570	Guess, uh, to clarify what I was asking is that it would not necessarily be Turned into a commercial property because the PUD is not necessarily commercial. It is not and that’s and we don’t want to to.

00:40:38,330	We want to restrict some commercial rezoning to commercial highway areas and that sort of thing because Uh, you know if you’re on a commercial, there’s a lot of different things that you can put in there. Where as a PD is is specific. Same thing with the special use. Um, the the big difference on some of these is is the use of the definition of the use and the the definition of each Tear. The ideas.

00:41:05,030	Um um On the The Blue Letter one, the ones from the stakeholder groups is not too much difference between what I what I had they They did have a they wanted some more definitions of that Which is fine, but you don’t want to restrict yourself just to those definitions. You.

00:41:23,200	Want some room for, uh, say somebody comes up with something new in the future that that is, is not, um you pick or a hay ride or that, etc. The. Um the other one is the difference. In, the the amount of people Um The The Department of Tourism wants the, um agricultural tier two.

00:41:52,970	They want to have a limit to 250 people at any time, and it would, uh, restrict it to 3030 events per year. In In. The Tier two level the Tier. Well, let’s start with the tier. One. Tier one is basically a right. That’s.

00:42:17,200	That’s Why, basically a tier one is for educating the public for having, um Like for, you know for training for for agricultural for farming for gardening, that sort of thing. That’s that’s uh uh, tier. One would be just a basic give right. You would not need a special use permit for T two would require the special use. And. That’s where you get into the Um hayrides. You pick, um I was F and patch kind of deal. The.

00:42:42,070	Only question is how many people should we have been allowing at these events and how many times per year The Uh, The amount of people that I I suggest using The Tier two Was, um Limited to Oh, where is it? He is hard to find. I think I had 100 people on there.

00:43:30,100	Yeah, I think was it in here for 100 then and then Chan change to 200. Or was it? Oh? It was 200 to 100 change to 100? The, um Oh and then and then to 75, actually, yeah. 75, the the Department of commerce wants to have 250 50 people allowed. And The stakeholders group. There to find. I know.

00:44:14,600	Um The Stakeholders group was going to be 50. So there’s a question there’s a different parameters. There’s different amounts and that this is like we do not have to make a decision tonight. But. These are things that you think about I.

00:44:31,570	I think that Uh, if you if you allow it an unlimited or 300 or 250 people at 30 times a year that’s to me is for some people that’s acceptable. Depends on where you are. And. You know it’s kind of a These special use permits can be adjusted. By variance. I think it it would depend on each application. If.

00:44:55,630	This is out in, uh Some of the townships that only have six families living in there. I’m. I’m sure that 250 people would not be a problem. But You know in these closer concentrated areas closer to the city of Bismarck. It could be well be an issue for the neighbors. So The idea is we wanna define that define the use.

00:45:18,670	To find the amount of people define the amount of number of years or a number of times per year. And, um You know the two levels of agri tourism or agricultural recreation tier one or Tier two. As defining that sections too. And and today we have. There is no definition. Correct. I.

00:45:42,130	Just wanna make that clear? Well? These are in the tier one and two tier two are what my I’m suggesting the city of Bismarck is going to a major and a minor. Um I. Don’t see, Uh, it’s a whole lot of difference, but it’s it’s To me, I think the agricultural Recreation tier one. Keeps it very simple. Tier two.

00:46:05,070	You’re just in the higher Hire more is not real more restrictive, but higher, a larger request bigger request to war, especially as permanent. Sounds good. Uh, Comm., patrick Question. Well, mitch. My understanding is that if if you limited it to, uh uh, a small number of people and a small number of events per year that a variance could be applied for to the county commission.

00:46:23,700	So if somebody wanted to say, say, limited to 100 people and somebody wanted to have 100 and 50 people they could go to the commission and ask for a variance. Is that correct? Or they can ask to amend the special I mean it’s it’s.

00:46:41,830	The idea is, if they if they run this thing, and they do a good job, and it’s not turned into a a big fiasco with with, you know a lot of traffic issues and that sort of thing. I mean, they can Al always go back to the commission and ask to increase that amount. It’s thank you. Yes, Comm. streifel. Uh, Mitch. Can.

00:47:03,300	You Explain Why egg agritourism is crossed out, and it’s changed to agricultural recreation is Because it’s I. I think that agricultural recreation is is more Um, it’s It’s more clear definition. In my mind. It’s not tourism. It’s It’s a recreation. It’s basically going out there and having a hayride having your pumpkin patch or any of these other events are suggested in there.

00:47:30,970	Um I, Don’t. I mean I’m not set on any definition or any defined use of our label for this use. But That’s where we’re at Last time We discussed this and You know you want to change it to a major or a minor agri tourism? It doesn’t matter to me.

00:47:57,230	So any other questions or discussion? Uh, yeah. Comm. strive. Yeah. I know, I noticed. Is it. Sarah Coleman. I noticed you shaking your head. No at one point Is that something that you wanted to clarify. Sure. Uh, Yeah? Yeah, absolutely. Please, uh One up and give us a Some some insight. Um good. Good. Afternoon commissioners.

00:48:23,530	I’m, Sarah Aie Coleman. I Direct The tourism, um, division for the North Dakota Department of commerce. I’m also a, UM, producer and egg producer in burly county, and we have run an acre tourism business in the past, so I have a couple hats that I’m wearing from this and and, um some some experience, I think that has

00:48:41,900	gone into some of the negotiations and discussions. I think my biggest concern with with Mitch’s presentation was that he was making it sound like it was just the tourism. Apartment and the Commerce department who created this and that wasn’t the case.

00:48:59,030	It was in discussions with the with five city planners as well as stakeholders where we came up with this revised group of numbers and it was a compromise. Kind of based on um you know, we’re where numbers were and and where profitability or where the where the interest might be right.

00:49:19,300	Um, when you’re looking at 1212 versus 30, it was it was discussed on how how you can create something that maybe it’s only Fang. You know, maybe it’s an apple orchard and they’re O. They’re open every day in September, Or.

00:49:40,630	Maybe, it’s uh uh, another festival of some sorts that’s opened Saturdays for six weeks, but to give that flexibility, um, to provide for the experience, which is what we’re most concerned about is providing experiences to our citizens and to visitors. So. That was that was my concern. I just wanted you to be aware of the fact that this wasn’t just Commerce coming up with these numbers and and and and presenting them. OK, thank you. Thanks for the clarification. Any other questions or discussion.

00:50:02,500	I would add that stakeholders group is with the city of Bismarck, not really County. The, and they have different parameters, totally different jurisdiction. Um Most of their stuff is on paved highways. So it’s um we have different issues different different complexities within the county.

00:50:26,730	And so it’s not that I don’t want to have a similar ordinance to the city. Or what the state wants or what you know it’s it’s the ideas that we have to Spread this needle. And so it’s If. You have any suggestions? Tonight? We can change We can add. We can detract We can do whatever you want on us.

00:50:47,630	Yeah Mayor Schmidt’s, So, the question would be Too much. Did. After the commerce comments, which probably are driven through the city’s Ordinance that’s in draft stage right now, too, and working through the processes to those comments, get back to the stakeholder group into the stakeholder group weigh in on those or from the county or not. I.

00:51:10,930	Don’t believe they did OK because I mean, I Hot? No. OK, So. I think my recommendation is that process needs to unfold a bit more. And like For me to read this. I would like to have one kind of edited. Document, right, and we just got these. No. And. I.

00:51:33,330	Just I’m just giving my own personal feedback, right? And yeah, so Um Yeah. We can certainly set up a group meeting a stakeholder group. I don’t know if It’s, You know we’ve already had meetings with them before, and I’m sure that they wouldn’t mind attending. But To nail those numbers down would help I put these in here as suggestions from different ideas from different groups.

00:51:57,300	And so Yeah. Comm. serle. Well. We did have a stakeholder meeting where it seemed like everybody was kind of in consensus. And, then a group of of the stakeholders actually came up with the the I think it’s in everybody’s pocket at the end the ordinance Was Edited and written up by a group of stakeholders.

00:52:18,730	So that actually came from the One stakeholder meeting that I thought there was pretty good attendance at I know a lot of the people in the room today were were at it, and that’s where this Um Last three pages on the agenda come from And those that’s the the blue colored, uh, lettering on on

00:52:40,030	this. What we are handed to, and there’s some things that that They May. They should be change in there as well, In my opinion, But, um You know we could hammer it out again if you want. Yeah, I think this is a you know, it really brings up a good point.

00:52:58,170	You talked about complexities in the county of that, uh, it it really depends on if you are in the In the surrounding Bismarck area, or if you’re in the you know, northeast corner of the county by, uh by wing.

00:53:17,000	Maybe, and, uh The trying to write an ordinance that covers the whole county is is a little tough, and I don’t know. I’m not sure what the answer to this is, but, uh, just a just a thought, is it? How? Is there a way that that there can be something that depending on where it’s at or what some of the other factors are. It changes. What some of these numbers.

00:53:32,900	Need to be and I don’t know what that is, but something that could could flex with where it’s located or how close the neighbors are or these types of factors that we always hear about. Right, right? I mean it. B application. I mean you could leave the you could leave the metrics blank.

00:53:52,230	And, have them come in and put their their numbers of what they want. And. They can start at 250. Or. They can start at 50 or whatever. But, you know, let this board So, but it’s kind it is If they want to have more and they’re in a less populated area.

00:54:09,470	You get less less, uh, public companion or public comments. I mean it. That’s what this board listens to, and that’s what the county commission listens to is the push back or the support and that’s what defines the approval for a lot of these things.

00:54:25,470	So It’s Yeah, it it just what would in just a question here? I’m not saying Oh? Yeah just, you know. Oh throw all this out. But what if if we were to do nothing And say, OK. We’re not gonna have an ordinance, but anytime wants anyone wants to do anything that is covered in this draft. That is a PUD.

00:54:43,830	Is that Would that be a good way to approach or not? Explain that to me, instead of someone having to come in, and and, uh get, uh get OK? I wanna do? Uh, agricultural recreation Tier two that is called out in here, uh, that that that’s not even in here and you say Well, if you want to do those types of things that’s covered under a

00:55:04,700	APD, you need to apply at a pud level. Uh, is that something that would be Good or not, or why it’s not gonna It’s not gonna be in the special use permit. If. They want to have a larger event center and increase these numbers? Absolutely a beauty.

00:55:25,630	OK you know, it’s it’s To find you wanna go big. Then. We’ll do a PE D, which is it’s a much heavier lift a much bigger lift. So. That’s the That’s the alternative to What is here so that we’re not saying that this is so restrictive and it locks things down if you wanna do something outside of this, then

00:55:39,570	you are now into a pud. Correct Absolutely OK, Uh Comm. mark Chair and commissioners Mitch Papa’s pumpkin patch Right now they’re what The pud? Yes. So. There’s Your There’s Your answer right there, so we already have something in the community that are already doing that, but So it’s not out of line, but Any other

00:56:02,900	discussion or questions for Mitch. So, Mr chair. Be My recommendation to take this draft. Um, the ideas in this draft and have the stakeholders group meeting again. And, then bring it back to the board.

00:56:28,030	So is that, uh, is that something that ah, that staff would like to line up or is that something that we need to Uh, make a motion on to have something created. What. What would you think on that? I. You can make a motion certainly, and staff can we can set it up and have a meeting at the same place that we’ve had it before. Here in All right.

00:56:49,370	It has been moved by Comm. munson seconded by Comm. Patrick. To set up a stakeholders meeting regarding Ah Article eight section 28. That However Comm. Yeah, OK. Is there a date you would like to T of that at all. I love to have it back here at the next meeting. The sooner we can get this wrapped up, the better.

00:57:17,070	Everybody’s gonna feel The first to open. Can we speak it? Uh, Yeah, it. Is there Anything. You’d like to add some suggestions before. So. Um again, I think I think we’re over complicating this? I? Really do I.

00:57:36,900	Think what we need to do is ah Uh, you write a base document, and mitch has got a lot of ideas in here, so we turn around and they know everybody’s sitting in there as well as you guys have seen a lot of the ideas out there, right? We need to just write a base document and then give our board of commissioners and our burle County commissioners.

00:57:52,500	We put our faith in you guys. But. That’s why we’re gonna issue a special use permit right so that wherever they’re at You’re never going to take care of everybody under that document. That’s why we’re fighting, and that’s why we’re struggling with this right now.

00:58:10,170	We come up with a simple based document and then give you guys the authority to write a special use permit based on whatever the circumstance might be. And we keep going around and around in a circle here, and it’s like I just don’t understand why this is that complicated. You know we come up with a base document.

00:58:27,030	We put the authority in you guys’ hands and the burly Conic Commission to write a special use when there’s a special use requested, And, either. It’s yay or nay. But we gotta have a base document, and I think it’s pretty simple and pretty straightforward. The definitions are out there. So. That’s my opinion. OK.

00:58:49,630	We will Is there any other discussion on the motion? All, Right hearing none. Uh, if you could take us through a roll call vote, Marla. OK. The motion is to have a stakeholders meeting and come back to the Planning and zoning Commission. In June. With A draft ordinance. Uh yes, folk mean to approve of the motion. No won’t mean you do not. Comm. streifel. Yes. Comm.

00:59:21,030	Bittner. No. Comm. Jarrett. Yes. Comm. Schmitz. Comm. Marquardt. Yes. Comm. Monson. Yes. Comm. Patrick? Yes. And mister Chair. Yes, thank you. Commissioners. Alright, uh, motion passes. You have the uh uh, an additional stakeholders group to, uh, put some definition around this and come back with a draft and that pass Houses.

00:59:57,270	That is, uh, all that is on our other business. Uh, is there any additional businesses that that anyone would like to bring up? No, I. Just have a question, Mr Chair. So.

01:00:16,570	Is this A was this a public hearing on this? Or was this just an introduction of this or No, no, no, This is not a public hearing. This was just a discussion on, uh, on the draft that was presented to us from or I. I would say I wouldn’t even call it a draft. I’d call it maybe a markup that was presented to us from staff. Uh, of, uh, some potential wordings in Article eight section 28.

01:00:35,270	This is the one that Marla sent out with the, uh three. There was some highlighted with red. There was red. And. Then. There was blue, Uh, font on it. OK, so it’s Yeah, it’s not a It’s not a a draft.

01:00:54,370	That’s all I’ve been at work all day, and I’m still at work, so I didn’t have a chance to review that so OK? Thanks not a problem. Any other, uh, business that we need to take care of other than adjournment. All, right? Who wants to do it. Move to adjourn. All right. It has been moved in second into adjourn. Is there any oppose to adjournment?