00:00:00,000	Right. Well, it appears that it is um. 3 o’clock, um. Today is Wednesday, September 18th, 2024. We’re in the Tom Baker meeting room and on Zoom if anybody’s out there, um, to conduct the historic preservation Commission meeting. Thanks as always to Dakota Media Access for, um, allowing the remote option and for recording this.

00:00:27,170	Um, I’d like to remind myself and everybody else to, um, mute your phones if you know how. Or your and your microphones when you’re speaking, when you’re not speaking. Um, if you would like to speak, please raise the hand icon if you’re on Zoom and you’ll be called on.

00:00:46,330	Um, Annie, would you call the roll, please? Comm. Zenker. Comm. Engel. Yes, Comm. Comm. Jackson, Comm. Perceley Comm. Swanson. Here Comm. Nodland Chair Serson here. Thank you. Right, um. And we do things in a different order now it looks like, so, um, under meeting information, we have a historic.

00:01:22,300	Preservation reports, is that how we’re doing it now? Um, those, uh, Chaserson commissioners, those are just for your information. They’re not really. Part of the discussion they’re in there just for your information if you would like to discuss it, we can. OK, thanks. Yeah, it’s just a little different order then.

00:01:43,070	We had had, um, our first order of business then is to consider approval of the minutes for both the July and the August meetings, um, individually, um, I will ask for approval of the July. Um, 2024. Um, minutes I move we accept the July 20, 17th,,, 2024 minutes. Comm. Pursley has, has, um, Um, Motion. Uh, do we have a second? It’s like We have a second from Comm. Swanson.

00:02:21,930	Um, any discussion on these or corrections? Hearing none of Annie. Mr. Rangel. Yes. Mr. Jackson, Comm. Purley. Comm. Swanson. Comm. Noland Sher Ackerson. Yes. Right, those have been approved, uh, the second, um, minute’s approval we will need will be for the August 2024 meeting minutes. Do we have a motion to approve those? I moved to approve the August 2024 minutes.

00:02:56,770	Do we have a 2nd, 2nd. We have a motion from Comm. Engel and a second from Comm. Jackson, um, do we have to accept the, approve the minutes? Do we have any discussion or corrections? Hearing none then Annie. Char Ackerson. Yes, Engel. Yes, Jackson, Perley Swanson Nodland. No.

00:03:27,670	All right, then we will move to the regular agenda and Lauren can. Get up to the podium. And plug herself in there because we have a section 106 review regarding, um, 1600 River Road. And the project there. Thank you.

00:04:07,130	Uh, good afternoon, Cherry Ackerson and commissioners, the city of Bismarck Historic Preservation Commission has been notified by the Northern Plains Heritage Foundation of the proposed project at 1600 River Road? This is in Bismarck, North Dakota, which would fall under the CLG uh review, um, and what this is why we are part of the section 106 here.

00:04:31,200	Uh, the proposed project would renovate Bismarck’s Keelboat Park and boat ramp, uh, and transform it into the Bismarck Riverfront Park and festival grounds. The city of Bismarck has been part of the planning process for this endeavor since about 2022. Um, the Northern Plains Heritage Foundation and the Fort Abraham.

00:04:59,400	Lincoln Foundation are coa applicants of an economic development, administrative edge grant, um, and under certain federal guidelines, the EDA designated the Northern Plains Heritage Foundation as the EDA’s non-federal representative for the purpose of consulting with interested parties such as the Bismarck CLG. Um, a map in two letters are attached within your packet, um, and therefore your review and consideration of this section 106 review.

00:05:24,170	And the historic preservation Commission reviews all section 106 review projects submitted to the city for evaluation and comment, um, section 106 of the National Historic Preservation Act requires federal agencies to consider the effects on historic properties of any projects associated with their involvement either through funding, licensing, approval, permitting, or any other similar activities.

00:05:52,330	If a federal project has the potential To affect historic properties, uh section 106 review is conducted and this just gives entrusted parties and the public a chance to weigh in on certain matters for the projects. Um, the historic Preservation Commission, um, evaluates these proposed projects as part of as part of this review process and a recommendation to the mining agency and, uh, the local Shipo or State Historic Preservation Office, um, is part of that

00:06:16,070	review. During this review, the historic Preservation Commission may also provide comments regarding the identification of historic sites, effects to the historic sites and ways to mitigate or avoid adverse. Adverse effects to these historic sites. A draft declaration form is attached for your consideration.

00:06:42,530	Any comments or recommendations provided by the commission at this meeting will be compiled and included on that declaration form, um, which will be submitted to the, the submitting agency as well as the North Dakota State State Historic Preservation Office. Um, part of the recommended action that staff is asking of the commission today is that the Comm..

00:07:09,930	reviews the submitted documentation for Section 106 review of the proposed project and uh provide comments and recommendations on it. Thank you. Thank you, Lauren. I do believe there is somebody from the uh northern Plains Heritage Foundation. If you have any questions of him on the project. Mm Erin, um, Would you like to to come up and I’m pretty sure you’re prepared to.

00:07:35,430	To give us a little info here. I got a 3 hour presentation if everybody’s OK with that. Yeah, of course, we expected nothing else, Erin. I don’t have 3 hours, yeah, um, no, thank you, commissioners, and, uh, for accepting this to review and consider, um, I believe I just had one other update of and maybe it was made apparent in

00:07:58,800	the, uh, documentation already already submitted through the Bismarck Historic Preservation Commission, but it was uh. Letters have gone out as of letters have gone out and I can confirm that they went out the same date of August 30th to the tribal Historic Preservation offices as well, um, it, it routes from the section 106 of

00:08:17,300	the US Department of Commerce. They delegated authority to the Northern Plains Heritage Foundation co-applicant for the Ram Lincoln Foundation, and then in looking at the state of Stork Preservation Office, it says to reach out to the tribal historic Preservation offices along with your local CLG which. Which brings me before everybody here, so, um.

00:08:38,370	That is the only real technical. Audition, uh, if it wasn’t covered in there, so. Yeah. And I stand ready for any questions, comments. Well, I have one question, um. Is Is there any it it when it goes forward, which of course it will, um.

00:09:13,030	Is there any uh proposed mitigation or monitoring? Um, that, that you’re anticipating, yeah, I mean, it’s a full disclosure too. I’m a, a permitted architectural historian and historian uh through the State Historic Preservation Office as well, um, but it’s, it’s, it’s interesting being on this side of the project because I’m both historic preservation nerd and also uh kind of overseeing this, this project, right? Um, but certainly something of

00:09:38,670	monitoring would make sense. It would make absolute sense just as far that is of a known place in what we using air quotes called prehistory, uh, it’s a known place for traditional gardens of, uh, Mandan Hadasa, uh, first peoples in this area.

00:09:59,100	We also know in the historic record that this is a known place for the steamboat warehouse is the complex both south and north of the historic rail bridge, uh, we know the spot just through photographs has had a steamboats that have been at that landing that of dock.

00:10:19,230	They Cam Fraser and innumerable times Camp Frasier, the buildup of the First World War, uh, and, you know, the just further south, of course, is the Bismarck Indian boarding school, which is now Fra Barracks, so. Certainly archaeological monitoring or or some type of monitoring would be more than appropriate during uh ground disturbance when that’s happening as well. Good, thanks. Yeah, that’s the one thing I’m, I’m aware of is from my paleontological.

00:10:43,500	Um, Period of time in my career, um, that the, the banks there are, of course, a sensitive, um, in fact, uh, The whole area along there is, um, Essentially a site lead for paleontological resources, you know, in a perfect world. I’d, I’d love to see some coring done to see what’s below, um, but there’s, there’s a lot of, when you look at the paleontology.

00:11:11,530	And the prehistory and the historic record. It’s, it’s quite an interesting location though being of course on the river bottom, we know how scoured that can be, but I remember looking at pictures of the, um, revetment, the, the, um, Reed mats that that were placed down in the steamboat days to prevent. Riverbank erosion.

00:11:39,530	I’ve always wondered if coring would reveal some of the layers of those things, but it’s not a perfect world. You mean the timbers that they would bring the boats up on for winter or they actually hired men to we have photographs of them with um.

00:12:02,800	Taking layers of of reeds and laying them in a herringbone pattern all along the, the riverbank, both sides usually to prevent, um, erosion. Um, it was a, it’s an interesting, it’s an interesting thing.

00:12:24,670	There’s not a whole lot of record about it, but you know, when you, when you look at the history of, you know, bogs and bog bodies and all that sort of thing, you realize that even on in a riparian environment like that, you can actually have a stratigraphy that might be. Amusing and educating, but but but it’s an interesting, it was an interesting period of time along that.

00:12:48,700	Part of the river maybe in the future we could have a partnership and a collaborative, uh, grant application of the National Science Foundation to potentially look at. Paleontology and and these sorts of things that would be yeah, continue to scratch the surface. It is always scratching the surface, uh, does anybody have any questions for Mr. Bart? Mr. Nodland.

00:13:13,230	I earn commissioner’s gonna be great, so I have a lot of questions, so I’m just gonna kinda ask them as we, as I, as I can and I’m sure you can answer, so. First off, to. Comm., I’m not sure what our role is at this point right now if you’re, if you’re asking for, um, I, I see it says for comments and recommendations.

00:13:31,530	So I don’t feel like we are in a position that we have information to make a approval or anything like that, um, if this is a 106 review. I my questions to you would be. Um, has there been an inventory done? Does how many are there sites down there with 6 numbers, um, has there been any work? I know that it’s pavement.

00:13:53,330	I’ve been there, um. Um, is, is there, this was It was had quite a few historic structures down there, including the ferry landings. So from 1870. 3 Till the railroad bridge was built, it was the main hub of transportation of goods to the West.

00:14:20,470	It it played a Nominally significant role in the history of Bismarck. From the time that the railroad bridge was built until the Memorial Bridge was built in 1922, it was the landing of the ferry system back and forth across the river. And so I guess my question is, is what historic preservation work has been done in this area.

00:14:41,600	And do we have that information? Has there Is it at that stage of the project yet? Or will you do? You know, I don’t think we wait till it’s done and then apply for a science, the National Science Foundation grant, and I feel like this is one of Bismarck’s most historic locations.

00:15:04,870	And so I’m I’m going to encourage us to Think of it as a historic preservation commissioners as to what is the history of this. Area of Bismarck and how. This is a project that’s for the future. It’s for people to use this the river and the city, and, but we are historic preservation Comm.

00:15:27,870	, so what is What is the interpretation that’s going to be done? At this site that’s about the steamboat and the ferry landing. And the ways and all of that. So my questions are more like This feels like a great grant to go and I see that you’ve got some buildings right where the cable.

00:15:48,130	So I’m gonna move the keel boat and we were very concerned about what the railings in the Balmas looks like I’m concerned about what, how, how does this beautiful opportunity present itself to Bismarck, um, for interpretation and education and speak to some of that. Yeah, to the, uh, thank you, Comm. Nodland, chair, I believe it’s chair now or chair Sackerson, Comm. in Ireland. Thank you for that question. Good questions.

00:16:12,170	Uh, the class one file search, uh, there’s been a prelim done and I would almost punt to uh Comm. Engel here as well, because Deidre of Metcalf Archaeology did a an initial please correct me if I’m getting it mistaken, but it was initial class one, Yeah, uh, Metcalf, um, conducted a class one and then um met with all

00:16:33,000	the players up at Shippo to discuss the plans and it was mainly so that they understood the funding and how the chain was going through and um we’re on on tap for further work and we know there’s gonna be more work to be done up there so I’m recusing myself from.

00:16:51,670	Yes, we did it initial class one this site have a 6I number yet? Does it have a No, it was just uh what’s there, what we know about it right now, um, and I think I, I, I didn’t do personally the, the, um, class one, so I can’t even tell you what the, what the, what the

00:17:09,270	what the what the result or is there anything Yeah, I, I could, uh, as a follow up rather than me trying to recall from memory. Um, I could follow up and send over the to the commission the results, the actual catalog. The Class one results of what was returned from that area in the immediate surround.

00:17:34,530	Asking you to. As the As the historic preservation Commission being asked to comment on a project on a very historic site in the past where we’ve had projects come to us without details we’ve said we want more details, um.

00:18:00,500	Do you, can you? Answer, do you know if there has ever been any testing or? Or anything down there along that area to see if any of the structures are left? I’m not as far as the you any structures meaning from 1870s like foundations and stuff, 1922, OK. You, I, I do not know, yeah, that’s a good question.

00:18:27,170	Yeah, from, from having done research in that area, particularly, um, more recently when we were establishing some things, uh, regarding the. The rail bridge Um, there’s not been a ton of. Um, testing. Or a ton of reports. Not, not, not a ton. I mean, there’s, there’s not a whole lot on the map there. I don’t know, uh, Comm. Swanson might recall anything from his days in the at the Shipo.

00:18:52,800	Anything that came up with that I guess what I’m suggesting is before. This opportunity moves down the track as it’s going to. We’re losing our iconic rail bridge we’re going to lose the any, I mean, it’s already paved, I understand that.

00:19:16,330	And I understand that, um, so my question is, is can we build in some inter interpretation of Bismarck’s. Steamboat and ferry. Location, and I don’t know if that’s already worked into the plans. I mean, I saw the plans that were in the paper and those, you know, online, but.

00:19:39,800	I think I understand that the The the river boat is down there, um, but, but as far as interpreting real Bismarck history for the public. So, so would you, if, if we are looking at as an action some our comments of course and recommended action.

00:20:05,370	Um, are where we fit in to, to this, um, and I guess that what I hear from you and what I know from my own feelings here that it would, it would be. A great opportunity. For us to recommend building interpretive. Um, information into this plan as it develops because there is information that can be gleaned, um.

00:20:40,900	Quite, quite actually it’s not too difficult to find um many interesting, um, Historical things that relate to that segment of property, um, and it’s also my understanding from. Historic preservation projects around the country that those sorts of um interpretive things that attached to a site that’s developing for people, where people gather is really a positive way to bring. The past. Into people’s. Minds, um, so I would.

00:21:10,670	Look at us as making a recommendation to make sure that if this as this project goes forward, that we are, you are incorporating. Um, the history of the, of the space with its contemporary and planned use. Uh, Comm. Purley. Chat Ackerson, it’s already paved over, uh, and I don’t know how long that has been, but was it, was there any kind of surveys or anything done back then and, and was the.

00:21:37,200	subject of signage discussed back then, how can we You know, keep this a historical area and point that out or was it just, OK, go ahead and go and pave it over and put a boat ramp in and we’ll see what happens. There hasn’t been, I mean, just because I used to do those.

00:21:54,870	File searches as Deidre did for this. There just isn’t a ton, um, out there because there haven’t been that many projects that have actually taken place there.

00:22:14,070	I know when the landing was put in, there would have been something, your new buildings there, there was something done at that time for that specific site, but as far as the larger package. I don’t think there’s anything that I can call to mind that covered specifically exactly. That thing because there hasn’t been a project that was disruptive enough or used federal money in any way that would force a 106. Um, record to be kept. Right, yeah.

00:22:41,970	Does that sound Like what you’re aware of as well to speak to, uh, yeah, kind of taking these in order and please uh uh let me know if I’ve forgotten anything to answer anything to.

00:22:58,970	I want to be as thorough as possible here, but, uh, with the 48 Lincoln Foundation on the Northern Plains Heritage Foundation, we’re in parallel without having a conversation like this up until now we are in parallel alignment with the Bismarck Historic Preservation Commission as far as using this as an interpretive waypoint, um, not only to talk about history amongst the people.

00:23:16,000	that are in this room that would already talk about history, but talk about an entree into capturing audiences outside of our sphere of historic preservation who would walk and use a site, um, you know, family centric sort of program that we have here and suddenly you have these cool interpretive, uh, displays you have, you know, it’s, it’s really the canvas as wide open as far as what we could what we

00:23:33,670	could do for interpretation of this area from first peoples all the way up through the steamboat era through the founding of Bismarck and such, so. Um, I want to just speak to, uh, Comm.

00:23:53,600	Nodland’s point there absolutely as far as interpretation, uh, the coring potential, um, I don’t see that being an issue as as far as potentially, I think it would, it’s always comes down to, you know, what are labor material costs on coring and and what might we be able to accomplish with, you know, the parameters of a budget, right? What, what, what could we accomplish that is, uh, you know, completely interesting as well, um.

00:24:11,530	What am I missing here too as far as. Comm. Noland Chairerson and Erin, more to, to add on to the things that you said, I am wondering if we could build that rather than being just. Um, the built environment, having the interpretive materials in there if there’s a way to say.

00:24:42,000	The And whether or not it’s They, you know, the HPC. Trying to get a grant to. Be able to do the written research and history of the spot. And this is, I feel like we’re in the same spot that we were when we were trying to find the history of Bismarck for our timeline.

00:24:58,530	It’s like, hm, where is it? How many people in here could speak to the history of the steamboats and the ferries in Bismarck. So it’s something that’s not really known and so I guess my question is, is not only to ask that the built environment have some interpretation, but that’s some actual history. Of the steamboat landing be done and ferry landing as well.

00:25:20,500	Exactly, and I think that Erin is and and his his group is well aware that that the, the history goes. Farther back than than we imagine and that actually we, we know from historical observation that, um. There was um.

00:25:54,630	Us by um The indigenous populations through here of that pretty much that exact area for um Driving You know, for fishing and for um. It was a good way to, it was a narrow spot to get across, you know, I mean it was a it was a crossing essentially before it was a landing and so I’m, I’m quite, I’m quite confident that, that, uh, Aarn’s, um, group is, is aware that any kind of

00:26:18,530	interpretation has to go back. not just. You know, are more recent history, but the Prehistory as well. Comm. Zacher, I guess my request is that, that we ask that that be done rather than, I mean, I, if it hasn’t been done yet.

00:26:44,200	And this project is this far along, and if we don’t know if there’s been any kind of inventory, I mean, you may know and you said you weren’t gonna come back if, if that If this historic piece of this isn’t yet integral to this project. I guess I’m asking that we ask that that.

00:27:05,070	not be left till hoping later that they find some money somehow to do this, but the the this get built in that this task get built into the project somewhere. If, if you’ve done a class one and are anticipating further work. I mean that that if we’re gonna review the 106 process. That’s what I’m asking for is could we know what the 106 process is. So we can comment on it.

00:27:26,470	Because it’s a great project. I’m assuming that they’re as the 106 thing goes forward, the, the rules indicate that we’re. This body is at least apprised of, of what’s going on with the. With information that’s gathered through, um, other parts of the 106 process I think. Comm. Jackson, Erin.

00:27:52,700	Since some of this stuff is dependent on sort of where you guys are at in the process and what’s coming up in the future. Where are you at in the process? Like when do you guys expect to actually, you know, start putting shovels in the ground and doing construction. And that’s not, uh, it’s a good question, Comm.

00:28:10,770	Jackson, and there still is, uh, this is a multi-jurisdictional location, so there’s. City of Bismarck, there’s a nonprofit collaboration there then of course it’s right up against the river, so you have Department of Water Resources, you have US Army Corps of Engineers. You have FEMA.

00:28:31,270	Um, we don’t like anything, uh, neat and tidy when our foundations decided to take on a project we like complexity piled upon complexity kind of inverted and then recalibrated to greater complexity, um. But uh Where we’re at in the project or the process is we, we receive the reason we’re here right now is we received from the US Department of Commerce on August 8th that this project merits further consideration.

00:28:56,630	And so that’s when we’re informed by the environmental nerds, and I say nerds endearingly. The environmental nerds with the US Department of Commerce that, uh, you need to start. Taking on 106 and NEPA review and that sort of stuff, so we’ve engaged in those those respective channels. And so, Uh, we’re still awaiting.

00:29:18,930	Awaiting more information, there should be some information we’ve been told before or by the end of uh federal fiscal 24, which is the end of the month here. Uh, we should get notification and. Some way in which of Of the US Department of Commerce’s economic development and administration, they’re finding or they’re. Whatever direction they go, uh, so.

00:29:40,400	And I’m not, I don’t mean to be uh Comm. Jackson, like fence straddling academic with my reply to you, but uh I, I wish I could say yeah, we’re going to Maynard’s after this and we’re gonna get some shovels and and we’re going to hit it, but it’s just that there’s varying understandable layers of permitting. That need to happen.

00:29:58,670	We’re, uh, from the get go though, we’ve been, uh, this project’s not only been informed but it’s also been, uh, uh, the input has happened through the city engineer, the city of Bismarck with, you know, engineer Gabe Schell, um, Jason Tomonic, uh, administrator as well, so, uh, Bismarck Mandan Convention and Visitors Bureau

00:30:18,970	is also looking at this as a a project beacon in the area as well. So there’s. There’s all these We got all the groups here, but we’re, we’re still going through that. Uh, understandable permitting process, yeah. Comm. Engel.

00:30:44,770	Hi, Erin, uh, one last question that came from Beth was what’s going to happen to the existing keel boat. Yeah, um. I was down there. This is uh February, I believe, and just taking pictures of the existing keel boat. In existing keel boat, I mean, it’s maybe it’s a round of conversation that we just have right here. It’s not 50 years or older. It’s a replica.

00:31:06,870	It was built by so far as the marquee says it was built by somebody in Iowa, I believe, um. What’ll happen to it? I’m. I don’t know, I mean. What should happen to it, right? Um. It’s, it’s not 50 years or older, it’s, it’s a replica, um, it doesn’t float.

00:31:29,430	If you put it in the water, so it is, it’s meant aesthetically to look like a keyboard keel boat. I’m not sure if it’s 1 to 1 scaled or. Not quite. Cheers section. Yes, Comm. Noland. Comm. Zacherson, Erin, it is the only interpretive thing down there right now for the landing.

00:31:51,730	And so the question is if it’s removed to build these buildings, will there be another one built or will it, will it, you know, I mean, It is the you’re, you’re assuming that it may be erased if it’s yeah, it’s not if it’s not, it’s an interpretive piece, but that’s where people go right now and the and then down the road a little bit to the steamboat, the replica

00:32:11,100	steamboat. But that is our. That is our piece that’s the nod to the to the keelbo age which has a valid, which isn’t even, which is more of the Lewis and Clark era and less of the steamboat landing era. So actually the kill boats did actually come up through here for for a a fair few years.

00:32:38,200	In fact, the there’s a keel boat in the park in Fort Benton, Montana. It’s a replica as well that’s being restored. Um, by old classmates of mine from college. But it is, it is true that the, to the point that I think Comm. Nolan is making is that we have um rather few dramatic.

00:33:05,970	Um, physical examples of a previous time in our history and so a a plaque. Doesn’t necessarily generate the same. Feeling, so when you’re losing something that has a different uh physical expression and perhaps has um younger people, particularly engage more with it.

00:33:32,230	I mean, we all, I certainly had my kids play all over it, you know, so those are things that even though it’s not 50 years old, it, it makes us remember a different time. And we don’t have other. Like specimens. Of that to to represent that. Time period so I can, I can see where, where you’re concern might be coming from that if it goes away, is there something.

00:33:56,130	Plan, but then it’s probably pretty early in the plans for that sort of more or less small scale for the type of project. Detail Yeah, and. I’m trying to figure out the best process of this too, right, as I, as we get up, you know, it’s not just like, I don’t mean this flippantly or whatever.

00:34:15,400	It’s not just Aarn sitting in his basement sketching out what it’s gonna be like. There’s all sorts of different, you know there’s licensed architects, there’s licensed landscape architects, there’s licensed civil engineers that are all informing this.

00:34:35,670	So would it be uh uh good for the Bismarck Historic Preservation Commission as you know, this for updates to get both not only a knowledge share update from our end to the commission, but Input from the commission that we can take back to, to informing a lot of this interpretive.

00:34:50,170	These interpretive opportunities, right, because we’re talking about the Q boat, the Lewis and Clark Q boat, which was in our area for a matter of a couple of days, right? And here we have this huge centerpiece now of the Lewis and Clark Keel boat, uh, I think there’s opportunities to do even more than just the keel boat though, and I’m not talking about a replica kill boat.

00:35:08,200	I’m just talking about like for centuries, for millennia, there is various peoples that, you know, knew exactly who they were, that are operating in this area, uh, living their lives in this area you know, grand opportunity for amplifying those things as well.

00:35:27,400	I’m talking about first peoples, right? I mean, we’ve got a corridor here of, of, you know, from Hugh Glass to Jim Bridger to, you know, the fur trade up and down the line uh in this area, uh, it’s the gateway to the Rockies, right? The water trail that is the Missouri River, we have opportunities there.

00:35:45,600	We, I mean, so I, uh, not that any of us anticipate to fully exhaust all the history that should be interpreted in that site, but I think trying to consider whether traditional means of interpretive history would be good, or are there new even digital platforms that could be folded over. That as well, are there, uh, You know, smart, yeah, I I Serson, yeah, yeah, I appreciated it too, yeah, so. Yes, Comm.

00:36:09,600	Purleyerson and Erin, can you say what the proposed buildings are that are on the sheet here. There’s 3 of them right now, yeah, there’s, there’s two footprint buildings, uh, and then the third one would be because with this space is intended to be activated 12 months out of the year, we needed a storage building, uh, which you see on the far left side of your sheet or where the entrance would be

00:36:26,300	and so that storage building would be where you put the winter stuff in the summer and then the summer stuff in the winter and, and swap them around, right? Um, the other two buildings, uh, one building is proposed to be a community space, so an actual space that the community could rent for their events, that sort of

00:36:45,570	thing. Um, I don’t have the square footages memorized. The other building would be uh a place for uh for adminning the site if you need operating at 12 months out of the year, you know, where do I go to check in when there’s an event happening on the green space right next

00:37:01,870	to the river. Where do I go to? Where do I go to get information for we’re at the orientation headquarters of the Northern Plains National Heritage Area. What is this space, right? Um, so there’ll be also public restrooms, um, that’ll be available 12 months out of the year as well, um, in the community room side there

00:37:23,330	will be a restrooms that will be available for the, the community room rental as well, so there’d be two sets of, of restrooms, yeah. Uh, thank you, Comm. K Nooblin. So, uh, is this a replacement for your current offices is one of these buildings. We, we haven’t gotten that far, Comm.

00:37:44,770	Noland, yeah. So this is not the big hotel complex thing that they was that it appeared in the newspapers a while back. Uh, no, this is, uh, for the scale the planning grant and the 3 big ideas that were communicated in that planning grant, uh, this would be just the riverfront park and festival grounds, and

00:38:08,600	then the other two were some uh uh at a different location, not this location of proposed amphitheater overlooking the river and then at a 3rd location it would be some commercial venture that’s not us that would potentially have a riverfront hotel, yeah.

00:38:28,330	These structures owned by the city or are they owned by the foundation? They would be they would have bumpers on them because they would be uh EDA because you’re using federal dollars it has to be 20 years, at least 20 years that they have to be used for a publicly spirited intended use, and so the bumpers on those, they would be uh owned or overseen

00:38:47,070	by the nonprofits for Lincoln Foundation or Northern Plains Heritage Foundation, and they would be on either City of Bismarck land or if the Land transfer of Continues to go to the Fort Lincoln Foundation. It would be 4 A R Lincoln Foundation, so. Hm Uh, Comm.

00:39:10,130	, uh, Swanson, Erin, are all of these utilities for these buildings? Are they going to have to go back to the lift station? Correct, yeah the excavation is gonna be quite. Quite a bit of excavating going on between those two buildings, engineer Gabe Schell has been, uh, we kind of went back and forth what it needed Comm.

00:39:31,400	Swanson, thank you for the question too, but we need certainly to figure out, you know, to where, where the stuff goes, right, uh, and so there it was proposal do it a whole another lift station and the footprint of these buildings and the size of the current lift station said that that current lift station could handle everything down there, so there will be a uh As you

00:39:49,000	see the, the trenching that happens to that lift station as well, so. Even potential more opportunities for. Stratigraphic excitement. I have one more question, sorry. All right Um Will this project be affected at all but if the bridge replacement. They have to if they’re going to there then discussion. Oh, the, the interstate bridge.

00:40:18,330	Yeah, um, no, we’re, we’re in touch with the North Dakota Department of Transportation on that through Gabe Shell, that sort of thing on our end, um, and I hear, um, I, I’ve, I’m not DOT, so I’m hesitant and reluctant to start opining on what, uh, what DOT is or isn’t intending that sort of thing.

00:40:40,400	I do know that, uh, just because of where our office is, the work is, it appears like it’s completing on the uh repairing or the. Updating of the I-94 bridge right now, the. The substructure, but it would, that would certainly be a question for the DOT as far as what they intend with. Replacement or.

00:41:05,870	Staying as the current bridge, right? And maybe that’s right through your torque. Replacement bridge That that would be a good question for DOT. I’m trying to stay in my lane. I really am because we know what happens when somebody comes off that bridge and almost hits the landing. We do know what happens. Ben, yes, yes.

00:41:26,370	Um, all right, well, thank you. Well, I, I think that as our role here is, is, um, to comment and to recommend. I think that it’s fairly clear that we’re recommending you keep in touch and that we recommend that, um, there are some, um, Opportunities that, um, we strenuously recommend that you explore for interpretation of the site going forward and that our

00:41:57,730	intent would be that um we would be Delighted to continue to be involved in, um, adding, Adding, um, Any Possible relevance we might have to your project. Does that sound as if what I’m hearing is what I’m hearing. Comm.

00:42:25,600	Noland, do you need something from us for your grant application? You know, it’d be nice to say that we really appreciated your update, Erin, and And, and we look forward to staying in touch and maybe even some waypoints saying like, you know, at this upcoming commission meeting, maybe it’s not the next one immediately, but maybe it’s every, maybe we set a schedule of upcoming commission meetings

00:42:44,670	where I can bring whatever information we have for updates to the commission because as this thing moves forward in 2 months, we’ll have more, you know, we, we just will. I don’t know what it’ll be, but we will have more so. We, we have a motion to generate uh a letter of a sort.

00:43:07,170	Lauren will have taken the points. Can I get some clarification on points here? I, I have some written down from what you had said. Um, you had mentioned monitoring and mitigation efforts to note that in the declaration form that we typically send out for this.

00:43:31,070	Um, some sort of interpretation element of this project and the continuance of that element going forward and then uh potential keeping in touch, um, Throughout the project, uh. Did I miss anything with your motions? Yes, the, the history, the actual history of the site, which if that comes through the 106 process, great, but if it doesn’t, if it’s, if it, but.

00:43:56,970	That somebody actually somewhere does the actual research. Thank you. So did you get up? So we have, we have written down it really helps me. Yeah, we know so uh.

00:44:23,570	Uh, Cherry Ackerson Commissioners, Erin, we will be sending out a form with all of this written down to you, so you will get it, um, I’ll have chairsackerson sign it if you would need an updated one as we move forward, please let us know, but we, we can get an initial one out to you for this give you something to, to put in your folder for your for your people because I think that it is important and it, it is our obligation.

00:44:43,830	To Have this conversation and to continue having this conversation according to our ordinances yeah, so anyway, I appreciate your. Putting so much Time and answering all our questions. I appreciate the questions too, so it’s, it’s been a pleasure both ways, I hope.

00:45:06,830	Did we have no, did we have, I have to do motion, so we have a motion, do we have a second to, to. Produce the letter that we have been discussing. We have a second from Comm. Swanson, a motion from Comm. Nordland. Any further discussion? Hearing none. Annie? Mr. Jackson, Comm. Perley. Comm. Swanson, Comm. Nodland, Comm. Engel. I’m recusing myself. Chair Sckerson, yes. All right, thank you. And thank you very much, Erin.

00:45:44,630	Thank you, Bismarck Historic Preservation Commission. It’s sometimes nice to have somebody on the same page philosophically with you. When you’re here, yeah, thank you. Have a great weekend. Thanks very much, Erin. All right, well, I’m moving on to the. Um, the second item on the regular agenda, the 2024 historic preservation Fund grant update.

00:46:13,330	Lauren, thank you. Uh, thank you Tri Akerson and commissioners, so staff have been working with Amy Munsen from the State Historical Society of North Dakota to finalize details for the 2024 North Dakota certified local government conference, um, this conference will be held October 7th at the Bismarck Event Center in the Birch and Cottonwood rooms.

00:46:37,600	Um, this conference, uh, the registration for it will open at 11:30, um, and closing remarks will finish around 3 p.m. A lunch buffet will be provided and a preliminary schedule should be attached within your agenda packet.

00:47:04,600	Um, staff has sent out invitations to all of the 8CLGs, as well as um different members of their government, including the mayors or other commissioners, um, and Staff has asked that these invitations be filled out by September 27th, um, just to get proper numbers to our caterers, um, and any additional information we might need for that.

00:47:29,730	Um, as noted within the preliminary schedule a brief 5 minute update from each of the CLGs is um supposed to happen during this conference, and this will be instead of uh a poster of the different CLGs that was noted at previous meetings. Um, this was just at the request of the State Historical Society.

00:47:50,130	Um, staff is currently working on getting a small conference, big you typically get different, I’ll call them gift bags if you will, um, and, uh. This was discussed with the members from the State Historical Society, um, it’s an opportunity to provide different, uh, brochures that the that we’ve created, um, through our historic Preservation Commission and get that out there to the different CLG’s, um, as well as providing some additional information from the State Historical Society as

00:48:15,430	they would like to provide some brochures as well. Um, no formal action is required at this time. However, um, I will ask that if you haven’t, please RSVP before September 27th, that would be greatly appreciated. Thank you. Thank you, Lauren and I’m glad we have till the 27th, and I haven’t missed it. Thank you.

00:48:41,800	Oh, right. Um, And it looks as if, uh, Uh, Comm. Engelen. Comm. Presley or going to be Um, Speaking During the conference, so thank you very much for that. you, you know what you’re gonna say, but you’re gonna be there.

00:49:10,670	Um, all right, on the regular agenda, we now have is we don’t have an action for this, so we’ll go on to the historic preservation Award, I C on the regular agenda. Lauren got her a minute to sit down. Uh, Chas Ackerson and commissioners at the July 17th, uh, HPC Historic Preservation Commission meeting staff was asked to work with Comm. Swanson and Parsley.

00:49:37,530	To rework some of the guidelines and nomination and the nomination form for a potential historic preservation award, um, a meeting was held on August 16th for this, uh, and changes were made, a revised draft of these guidelines and the nomination form are attached within your packet, um, a potential timeline for implementing this award is also included.

00:50:01,900	Um, eligible projects for this, um, through this discussion at this meeting, uh. It was determined that these must be completed by December 31st of the previous year. Um, so for example, all eligible projects for the award, um.

00:50:24,800	Uh, that would be presented in May of 2025, uh, they would need to be completed by December 31st of 2024, if that makes sense. Um, an eligible project would also need to have been completed within the last 3 years. So, for example, um, I’ll eligible projects that would be considered for the May 2025 award um could be completed no earlier than January 1, 2022. That’s within that 3 year time frame.

00:50:52,600	Um, one of the major changes. Um, that you can see. So there, there’s a couple different changes that were discussed. Um, one of these was, um, having three categories for the award, um, and this would be a building or site category, and education category and a public awareness category.

00:51:16,600	So eligible projects submitted under the building or site category would be evaluated based on how well the projects demonstrated historical or architectural significance and how well they aligned with the Secretary of the Interior Standards, um, This is pretty common among other historic preservation awards that focus on this type. Um, and so.

00:51:40,670	As kind of stated, this is kind of more aimed at sites or the built environment or any culturally significant area that has ties to historic preservation or Bismarck’s history, um, Eligible projects submitted under the Education category would be evaluated on how all the project increased the knowledge about Bismarck’s history or historic preservation in general, um, for example, this could include events like a public lecture,

00:52:08,970	um, that provided robust knowledge about uh Knowledge to people or this could also include educational institutions or programs that provided knowledge knowledge to members of the public, so that would be moving beyond just teaching within a classroom, it would be to the public in general.

00:52:31,930	Um, additionally, this could also include, um, people in the community who have gone out of their way to document history and provide that knowledge through different means, um. That, uh, gets out there to the public.

00:52:59,130	Eligible projects submitted under the Public awareness category, um, This would be uh evaluated based on how well it provided awareness about the history, uh, and historic preservation efforts of Bismarck, um, and this is more so aimed at resources that provide awareness, um, an example of this could be potentially historic markers, um, brochures, pamphlets, um, even potential art or cultural pieces that provide awareness, um, to either difficulties or achievements. and historic Preservation, um, Those are just some examples. They’re not all inclusive, um.

00:53:29,000	But those are what was kind of discussed there, um, additionally, there was discussion as to the format of the award. Um, however, during discussion, it was determined that that should be brought to the historic Preservation Commission for further discussion on how to do that.

00:53:50,400	So either having it as um like card stock certificates or having a plaque or perhaps both. Um, and potential funding for those could be included within our, our yearly CLG grants, um, if we, if we would like to use it that way. Um, so there’s two separate recommended actions for this specific item tonight.

00:54:17,070	The first one is, um, asking the historic reservation Commission to review the updated draft nomination form and guidelines. Um, if the historic Preservation Commission is satisfied or if there’s a couple comments or changes you would like to see made, um, please provide direction to staff on what you would like changed, um, as well as for uh just the implementation of the nomination and award, so would,

00:54:40,000	would you like to follow this, uh. Proposed timeline or is there a difference specific timeline that you would like followed? The 2nd recommended action is determining the format of the award.

00:55:00,330	Would you like this as a plaque? Would you like these as certificates? Would you like it as both? Um, so there’s two separate actions that we’d like clarification on tonight for that. Thank you. Thank you, Lauren. I have um one addition I think under your nomination information under public awareness, you have um Books, journals, articles, etc. I think you should include artwork. Hm Because that’s not actually. As a category, I think that’s also a legitimate educational. Um, expression.

00:55:38,830	I think you guys did a lot of work on this. Yes, Comm. Adlan. I have a couple of suggestions. Um Good Oh, I could On the table for the timeline. Could you mark or in the in the text as well maybe. be put that the deadline for submission is March 30th at 5 p.m.

00:56:09,300	And then put somehow uh. So they can do the, do the. Some instructions for how and where it needs if it’s if it’s the paper form plus one additional or employee page plus photographs. How did they Submit that and where? Um, chairs are Comm. not commissioners, um, so I could provide some clarification on that aspect.

00:56:39,670	Um, we probably have the form based on our website. Um, there’s some other. Groups within the city that do have nomination forms as well, and we’ll likely follow how they have it so there should be a way that they would be able to upload all their items on there as well And our website and our I mean our page within

00:57:04,730	the cities and then digitally submit your form by 5 o’clock on March 30th, something like that. Correct, yup, I can do that. Correct, yes. Thank you. um, and can we say 5 o’clock on the 30th or so something like that that gives people a. A deadline Wait.

00:57:26,800	Wait, but the dog ate my application, so I can’t get it in until 111 p.m. Yeah, I know what you mean. And I ask this in a couple of previous meetings and I And I’m gonna ask if we can try to answer right now.

00:57:49,530	I How are we gonna pick? How are we, how is this review gonna happen because right now it says that that there’s a selection committee, so. Who, who is the selection committee and how are they formed and. Um, what, what constitutes the members? Of the selection That’s a great question, Comm.

00:58:13,600	Nolan, chair of Commissioners, there was some discussion at the meeting on this, um, mainly different criterion, uh, how, how this selection committee would be decided, um, discussion mainly resulted in Uh, a couple members, uh, similarly with how we do our subcommittees, they would be selected at the beginning of the year when the when the form would open, um, and that’s how the selection committee would be decided.

00:58:37,970	It, it would be changing every year if, if needed, or it can stay the same, but since the commission tends to update occasionally, it would make sense that it would be chosen or the people would be volunteer every year for that selection committee. OK That is correct. That’s typically what we found with our peer communities that’s typically what different commissions have done for that.

00:59:02,700	as long That’s known that it’s not um. You know, Maybe if it’s gonna be reviewing these through April. Um If there’s a way to somewhere. And and then that should be on the the HBC calendar as well for January or February is to make sure that we’ve identified that.

00:59:22,230	So I suppose that what we could do at this point is say how many. Members of uh how many members of the. Um, HPC. Um, Will serve on rotation. Um, Comm. Berson. Mm With a small committee or with a small commission like we have.

00:59:52,170	Do you need to have a subcommittee that picks the winners, you know, everybody will, you know, or can we all just come together? We, maybe we have a subcommittee that reviews the submissions and brings a recommendations to the commission, and then we can vote as the body. Rather than picking out 2 or 3 people off the small I think Lauren has a a comment here that that’s a great point. Thank you, uh, Comm.

01:00:12,430	Perceley, chair of commissioners, um, so. Yes, I, the typically with your subcommittees, they do discuss things and then they bring it to the larger historic Preservation Commission for as a recommendation. Um, they wouldn’t.

01:00:37,030	Really have the power per se to choose the actual nominees, um, for this, um, so it would come back to the full historic preservation Commission with a whittled down list um of the different applications. I, I will also make a note that not every year we have 3 awards. It, it really depends on the different applications we get and And their content that they include, would it make more sense then? That It’s just This Entire board.

01:01:03,470	Looks over the things and and. And decide that we don’t have to have a separate subcommittee that it’s just. I’m sorry Mm Comm. Noland in on television in front of everybody we have that discussion. Oh, well, yes, that’s a fair point. Comm. personally, it says that that that is on the in this table, this thing.

01:01:30,170	It’s in the 4th box of. in agreeing the recommendation. So if we want to change that, we’d have to change that too. But Well, if the subcommittee works, that’s fine. You’re, you’re, you have a, you have a, a good point with the. Um, do you want to do it all on. Um, life, whatever.

01:01:52,770	And my other, so another question that I have in general, I hope we can answer this is. Do we have, uh, is there, are there any limitations on this? Is, is there a Can we have the The same person, the same organization, or the same entity win it. Uh, multiple times.

01:02:16,800	Or do we move it around? I don’t think you should necessarily deserve it, they deserve it, it doesn’t matter if if they, if they’ve done it 3 times, super, you know, I don’t think that, that I don’t think. That we need to unless somebody feels strongly about it. I don’t think that we should make a limit like that because I think that that’s. Maybe Christian Nolin.

01:02:37,700	I just want to clarify that that there’s some that they try and spread it around a little and rather than the same person winning the award every year. So my other question is.

01:02:53,270	This is the stuff that I’ve been asking every time of how do we, can we determine this stuff so that when this goes out, we know how this election is going to be made. So one of the things in here is for the selection committee to look at and for the. applying or nominating somebody is the like, I think it’s for the public outreach. The increased public awareness. What, what’s the metric for that, that the subcommittee will measure.

01:03:13,470	I mean, is it? We have no metrics to me to to determine how this will be ordered. Is it number of Lectures given or eyeballs or downloads, I mean, I’m just kind of curious of of how we’re gonna, how would a person put, what do we want them to put on here where, where we ask them

01:03:33,270	to say. How they have increased public awareness. Well, I think we let them defend themselves and, and we see if it rings true. Comm. Swanson. I, I sent something I got from Fargo, uh, from the historic, the heritage. Group there I don’t know what it is. But it’s pretty intuitive.

01:03:57,770	It’s pretty, I mean, it’s, and it’s pretty subjective the way they lay out the criteria or the what the subcommittee might use, but it also I think was, was brief enough that it would, uh, explain what some of the criteria might be or what uh you know, for the people applying. You know, so we say for, uh, you know, for uh.

01:04:18,600	I can’t read these are very small. I tried to get as large as I could. I’m sorry rehabilitation, for example, um, um, You know, it’s. I, I, I just think it is fairly subjective.

01:04:40,630	I mean, you know, except for the standards, uh, you know, the, the, yeah, the preservation standards, but Well, I know on, on some grants you like they wanna know. your audience numbers or your participant numbers or your, you know, they’re evaluating there’s some metrics for, for people, and I’m not talking about a document that would would be public, it’s more for the subcommittee making the evaluation.

01:05:00,870	how do we If you’re on the subcommittee, it’s not just which one you thought was cool, but it’s got some, there’s some basis understood that. And I haven’t, I haven’t seen it, so I don’t, I don’t, I can’t read it from where I’m at, so I, so I’ll look at that, but that’s just. I just think if this is the time we’re forming it.

01:05:16,900	Let’s And if, if, if it’s subjective, that’s fine. I mean, if it’s, that’s OK too. I mean, I, I just think we should. Decide if Right now I, I also have, I talked to the uh coordinator for the Grand Forks Historic Preservation Commission. They also do an award.

01:05:39,400	I do have their criteria that they use, which is also very subjective, um, I’ll, I can pop it up on here. I’m hoping I can get all the ones I’ve looked at have been. In the past year or so I’ve always been quite subjective, bit difficult to see, but um And if that’s what it, I mean, I’m thinking about like when you’re, when you, when you’re.

01:05:59,430	Competing for a uh a grant or and a contract and it says this is how it will be weighted, whether or not it’s it’s this or this and And so I’m OK with it not. I’m just asking that we just make a public decision, you know, a statement that This is how you’ll be, if we’re looking at the examples which are compatible, the examples

01:06:18,630	you’ve looked at are compatible with generally our aims. Lauren. Um, so it’s very hard to see, but I, I guess 2 on here, um, how they have it, these are noted as their criteria for selection, um. For the award and, and I did get. A confirmation from the coordinator on that as well.

01:06:44,370	Um, so number 2 on here says uh the award should be given to an individual who has enhanced historical perspective and maintain the historical heritage of the city of Grand Forks. Very, very vague, um, kind of lens interpretation in there, um. So they both communities have been doing this for.

01:07:06,370	2030 some years, um, and they do tend to have Graham Forks is a little bit more uh selective on how they do it. They don’t select a winner every year, um, Fargo Moorhead, they do. Pick more since they do have 6 types in there, um.

01:07:28,730	So there there is some play in here on how they do it, but it, it does look like both of those pure communities do have it it’s a little bit more selective there. Let’s leave it a little more suggested. I think so, you know, for, for one thing, you know, we’re living where we’re living. And it, it, this is not um.

01:07:52,170	isn’t a community that goes out of its way by and large. To meet anybody’s historic preservation standard, um, and so. I, I think that one, what we’re looking at doing is encouraging. The kinds of um. Visual Um Products that. are in keeping with um. With our general goals.

01:08:29,070	Well, if you say, I mean, I’m looking because if it’s not visual, you can’t see it, but well that’s true of speech or a lecture, yes, that’s, that’s true. But yes, lesson plan, you’re quite right. Um, that I, I think that. We’re supposed to be encouraging. All these sorts of things, so I think that we should be as um open. And, and less restrictive.

01:08:57,730	In in how We get people to engage in in this because we’re trying to encourage not punish or shame or we’re trying to encourage. Comm. Bursley, I, I agree that sometimes you can. Work yourself into a corner if you put too many regulations and you start grading and scoring every little thing, people won’t do it.

01:09:20,970	It’s just too much of a hassle, you know, if, if they can turn in a form showing that they’ve done this and know that they’ll be considered rather than 20 or 30 questions that you got to give a grade to. I, I think they’re more apt to do it.

01:09:38,170	Because it is participation partly is, is one of the things we’re looking at and one of the things all the questionnaires and things like that that we have been looking at over the last couple of years. We do, we need to engage more, we need to be more, um, More open. To to people relating to us. Comm. Noland, Zacherson.

01:10:01,830	I guess what I’m hoping is on this we’re gonna ask people to tell us this, and so I’m hoping that we can give them some help, not punish or shame them, but say, how do they do this for us? And so if what we want to know is how many attendees or how many publications, I mean, what, how are they gonna tell us that they’ve increased public

01:10:21,630	awareness? How many, how many hits on there? I mean, what are, can we give them, can we give them 3 examples and then say or anything. So, I’m just curious.

01:10:48,300	I mean, I’ve, that’s many grants that I’ve written have have have given help to the grant writer to say fine to ask that because one of the things that I think is really important here is for people to learn to express themselves. And their success and their. In, in their own words.

01:11:13,600	To try to to get them to see, OK, I did this, how actually they’re asking me to ask it how actually did I, you know, you’re asking them to judge themselves a little bit in, in their, what they give you. So I guess that I’m fine with it the way it is. Uh, Lauren, Oh, I was just up here to answer any questions if there were any, sorry, I think this is all going to be solved by the nominations themselves.

01:11:30,600	I think people can look at, people are going to know what the categories are, and they’re gonna, you know, they’ll be able to say, well, here’s why this fits into the category. I mean they’re going to have that information ahead of time, right? They’ll be able to see what the categories are and.

01:11:43,330	I don’t see any, I don’t see any reason to put metrics on it. I think the nominations will make a case for why somebody deserves the award in a given category. I think that’s good enough. Mr. Swanson, I agree with the Comm. Jackson. Uh, also, um, Uh, I think under the building or site under nomination information.

01:12:06,830	That we should include craftsmen. They have a category for craftsmanship. In Fargo, I know, and, but I think if it could just be added to this, you know, the planners, developers, preservation craftsmen, or property owners. I like that. Yeah, I mean there’s a certain, certain level of skill. For a lot of that.

01:12:32,170	Uh, what we’re talking about, so. Mr. Engel. Um, with these, we’re we’re trying to get people to highlight, um, their contributions to the community. So I think it’s very important not only to select the best, but recognize what all has been taking place.

01:12:56,530	So I would say that if we could get a list of the nominations have been presented to us for consideration, that will also help bolster this and get people thinking about what else they can do, uh, in the community. I will not, uh, I’m just gonna go back one slide here.

01:13:16,730	I did find a really interesting thing that Fargo Moorhead did, um, with their data, they actually have a public facing map of all their different awards, um, and they highlight it, and it’s, they also make their list available as well for all other things. I’m not sure if this is something we’d like to do, but we could do something similar to this. If we can, why not? And uh. Beckerson, Comm.

01:13:40,870	, I guess, um, I think we should ask the awardee before we do it and you know, the same way we’re at. So that if somebody doesn’t want their. Project Publicly listed, they could opt out, at least give somebody. That option.

01:14:02,200	So if you get an award for say building a, you know, some craftsman thing building a heritage piece and but you don’t necessarily want it on a public map. You could have that choice of not having your information on the map on a publicly available map. Laura, I’m sorry, uh, that’s a great point, Comm. Nolan, um, And Comm.

01:14:24,500	Swanson did have a point on permissions for this grant, perhaps there’s a 2nd question that uh the person could check if they’d like to be opt out of including it on a map under that, um, got a location for it right there. Under your permission notice. All right. Hopefully It’s, you never know. You never know. Right.

01:14:57,030	So we have Getting back to what we were supposed to be doing here, Comm. Engel, I think we need to decide on what it looks like a certificate, a plaque was physically they get.

01:15:20,630	We have any thoughts on that? I, I personally like a certificate, but if, if it were a building or then it, there’s already a plaque, you know, method for that, but either one or both. I mean, I’m, I lean toward the certificate, but I’m OK with both. Mhm. Any other preferences? Comm. Swanson. Yeah, I agree with the certificate idea, um, Comm.

01:15:45,170	Pley mentioned at our meeting though, an idea of the kind of metal plaques that you see that where a little tag can be added annually if it’s annual thing or something like that, so you’d have a, have something then we’d have something posted someplace. I mean that would be one. Item the certificate would be the one to be given to the.

01:16:01,800	To the award, you know, person who was awarded the thing, but if we just, we had a plaque listed all the each, each year there was Somebody’s name added to it or two people, however many there are projects. I think that’s something that um. We do with uh.

01:16:24,700	Ski patrol, they have a plaque that sits at the headquarter at the office and has people’s names put on it, but the person gets a certificate, they don’t have to lug the plaque home with it is that, is that what you were envisioning something like that. Lauren’s office.

01:16:48,700	Um, I, I could talk, uh, I could talk to our Ben with the community development department and see if there’s some place outside our offices that we can kind of highlight that, um, I, I think it would be a uh. Different conversation if we would talk with admin on placing it. We do share this building. Uh, with county, so it’s not just city in here, um. Potential for outside of our offices for the moment that might change in the future.

01:17:10,570	I, I will need to discuss that further with my department director on that. Comm. Engel, um, one other thing because I, I do work uh for a business that likes to highlight these things. Um, I would like uh a little developed um digital signature that said, you know, HPC historic Preservation Awardee.

01:17:37,470	Or something so that they can add it to their websites digital, yeah, so it doesn’t have to be significant, but so we can add that. So, so we’re, we’re leaning toward. The certificate. With it, if it’s a business, a digital, whatever you call it nonprofit or. Yeah, some sort of a. Um, and Um, and if it’s possible for us to have a plaque that could be put in.

01:18:03,430	The the city Somewhere Um, they were, yeah, that we could, we could do that, but, um, so I guess doing, I don’t know that we. We need a motion to those. Concepts here, uh, I would appreciate an emotion for moving forward with. How the guidelines are laid out with your comments taken.

01:18:31,830	Into consideration and made changes too, as well as what type of format we’re going with or a certificate plaque, right. So folks. I’ll second. So we, we have a, a, a motion I’m assuming this is how it goes from Comm. Swanson, um, that we like the way, uh, this looks. As with the alterations or the additions that have been.

01:19:05,830	talked about today too, um. And A 2nd from Comm. Engel. Or this This Way of of. Putting together the the Um, Nomination For And guidelines, um, with the alternation alterations that have been discussed, so we have a motion, we have a second. Do we have any further discussion? Yes.

01:19:37,370	I just want to make sure that the 2 that I asked were for there to be an actual deadline on the chart and the second was that there be Explicit directions somewhere in this about how specific. Yeah, and we have those. I have Check marks on my And checkout or opt out.

01:20:06,830	So I think we have agreed that those are the The 3 pieces that we care to to have altered. So, oh, and at Crest 4th an artwork and artwork to the list. So there are 5 then small alterations. All right. All right. Lauren, Lauren has those all, so, um, Hearing no further discussion on those, um, and. Comm. Engel, yes, Comm. Purley. Comm.

01:20:41,970	Noland, Comm. Swanson, Comm. Jackson, Chair Sckerson, yes. And our second action we need to discuss the, um, Uh, the format. Which it sounds as if we would like to have a certificate we would like to also have a digital. Whatever image. And um explore the option of having um. A motherboard.

01:21:14,600	Plaque that might be housed in the, in the city somewhere, but barring that. We would be looking at. The digital. And the certificate as the things that we are looking at for the format. Um, And And I guess we can do we somebody can move that um we have those. Formats And with the potential of.

01:21:46,070	A a plaque. But we don’t have permission for that, so. Should we just I would, I don’t know how somebody wants to to make that motion whether we want to leave the mothership blackout. We still got a motion on the table. Right now, no, we already did we have discussion, yeah, we did that. Sorry. I did.

01:22:08,530	Oh yeah, of course, of course. Didn’t your motion include the certificate, I don’t think it did or did it, did it? I thought he did too. Oh, well, if we all thought it did, then it did include the certificate, no, no, we didn’t include the certificate of the plaque, so we do have to have a separate

01:22:28,230	motion for that. There was a 1 or 2, so we, we did the one I’m on number 2. Yes, Comm.. Cheers Jason, I, I would like to move the the Bismarck HPC’s annual historic Preservation Award. Given in the form of a certificate and digital badge that accompanies it and that.

01:23:01,800	Uh, it that we have the that we are exploring the Option of doing a single plaque that would be updated annually. All right. We have, we. We have a motion from Comm. Noland and a second from from Comm. Bursley to have the digital badge, the certificate, and explore the option for having a, um, permanent plaque to be updated yearly.

01:23:37,630	So do we have a second? Oh, we had first, we had a 2. OK, any further discussion? Hearing none, and Responsive Yes, Mr. Jackson. Comm. Purley Comm. Engel Comm. Engel Comm. Engel Comm. Engel Thank you everybody. All right, other business, do we have any other business? Comm..

01:24:16,700	Engle, just two quick updates, uh, one, the subcommittee for the plan, um, met on Thursday last week, um, and we furthered our goals a little bit. We worked on some goal sections, um, and we’re also developing, uh, what we’re terming a threat list for those endangered commun uh areas of our community that might be, um.

01:24:36,170	Subject to more tear downs or anything like that that we want to keep our eye on and maybe do some more, uh, survey work in that coming up in the next few years. Um, I still have not had a chance to, um, process the raw data from the survey, but I will be getting to that shortly.

01:24:56,170	And then the second thing is that I have half of the RFP drafted for survey work coming up. Um, I will hopefully get that finished this week and then send it to my colleague. To our, uh, Comm. Nooblin, uh, for her review, and then we will present it to the committee next month. Thank you very much, Comm. Engel.

01:25:21,700	All right, um, then hearing no other business or updates, we will adjourn the meeting until It October 16th? For our next