00:00:11,830	County planning and zoning, uh, commission meeting. Uh, this is a special meeting and uh we’ll have a public hearing tonight. We will start this meeting with a roll call. So Marla, if you could take us through a roll call? Sure. Comm. Bittner. Yeah Comm. Connelly, Comm. Jarrett, Comm. Munsen here. Comm. Patrick, Comm. Rich. Comm. Streifel here.

00:00:40,530	Commissioners are off. Chair Here We have 8. Alright, we have a quorum. OK, we will move into the uh the public hearing that is on the agenda. I will, uh, let everyone know that we do have in front of us we have 3 drafts that uh we, that, uh, we can take a look at.

00:01:04,300	We don’t need to adopt one of these drafts. We are going to be looking at just a language to get a draft. Uh, to the county commission, uh, so it is not one or the other of these, it can be one, it can be a mix, it can be modifications to, uh, we’ll be focusing on the language of the

00:01:23,600	of this this ordinance tonight, not necessarily specific uh specific businesses or interests in this, the language of the ordinance is what we’ll be focusing on, uh, leading up to this, we’ve had 3 stakeholder meetings, uh, that, uh, that staff has, has a Run and uh.

00:01:45,300	Yeah, as we, as we go through this, uh, please do let everyone have a chance to speak before you, uh, if you’re going to come to the uh the lectern again, uh, so please let everybody have a turn, and I would like to have you have everyone try to limit their comments to 5 minutes per person, uh, and, um, yeah, be respectful of everyone’s time.

00:02:02,470	And Mitch, if you could take us through the uh some of the details of this, uh, and then we’ll open it in the public hearing. Good evening, commissioners. Mr. Chair, Um, tonight’s agenda had originally had 22 ordinances, draft ordinances. I sent you a 3rd ordinance this week.

00:02:26,870	Uh, it was a little late in preparing, preparation for it. We have been hammered as staff on our department with a lot of things on our desk and, and it was unfortunate, but I tried to get it out as soon as I could. It’s basically we have 3 versions in front of you. The first version.

00:02:49,170	I, um, we all know what the Agritourism is agro recreation is defined. We kind of do we need to go through that? OK, on the first version, the tier tier one is uh for education, um, and, um, he used in conjunction with a single family, uh, basically a single one day event about for regarding agriculture, agricultural practices, activities in agricultural

00:03:13,930	products, tier 2 is the um agriculture-related use that combines production with recreation uses that are in common with an ancillary to the primary a Cultural use such as pumpkin patch, farm festivals, corn mazes, hayride, trail rides. Yup pick orchards on farms, for our culture demonstrated farms, you picked Christmas trees, etc.

00:03:37,830	Tier one does not have a limit on the amount of people. It’s just, it’s, it’s allowed by right under agriculture, um, tier two is uh special use permit in an agricultural zone, the attendance is limited to 75 people. The amount of events are limited to 30. The second version. As the tier one.

00:04:05,500	same as the first one, but it does allow uh agricultural recreation activities. Of up to 50 people per day. And that’s as part of agricultural district that’s an allowed right. The second tier, excuse me, tier 2 is Same thing as the version one, but it goes up to 100 people.

00:04:35,800	Which uh is limited to 35 events per year, a special use permit is required for that. The 3rd version. which I sent to you today, which Um, we’ve gotten a lot of. A lot of comments online and from people’s email and that sort of thing.

00:05:00,670	I guess I kicked the hornet’s nest over on that one, but the idea is these are very similar, uh, it’s, and I will go into more depth on on the third version. Uh, again, it’s tier one. Up to 50 people a day allowed by right. I will say one thing, only thing that that I should have added to that or or your consideration tonight is limited to the number of days for that.

00:05:21,970	It can’t be a 365 days a year that would be a, you know, commercialism of the property. Tier 2 is uh goes up to 75 people with the corn mazes and the horticulture and that sort of thing up to 75 people, 30 events per year.

00:05:41,970	Tier 3 is this identical with the tier 2 with the users, but it goes over 75 individuals. And the number of events are not listed. So the intention of tier 3. I excuse me, also I defined events. Event is a planned single use single one day public or social occasion. Uh, the intent of Tier 3. is based on the flexibility of zoning.

00:06:16,030	Zoning should never stifle people’s dreams or their plans to reuse their property the way they think it would work for them. Tier 3 allows a at a higher occupancy. Um, and it’s, there are no limits to the amount of days that would be set by you as the board of commission planning commissioners. In the court of public opinion.

00:06:36,730	The good people of Burleigh County will determine if they want that next to them or not. And that’s up to you guys to wade through that and figure it out if, if 100 people is OK, if 200 people is OK. If 10 days a year is OK, that’s will be up to this board.

00:06:55,100	It’s allowed the flexibility in the diversity of, of zoning to. To be more creative, in other words. I once saw on a Uh, notebook at a planning commission training. The uh Mm I was it world peace through zoning. And so it’s kinda. That’s what, you know, we have to be flexible enough to, to.

00:07:21,700	To, um, allow it, but also to prevent any kind of disruptive or conflicting issues with the neighbors. Or problems for Burleigh County, the cost of Um, Ordinance control. So that’s, that’s basically it in a nutshell.

00:07:48,700	It’s, it’s uh, I did add on uh Section 1A 15 additional conditions may be included in the special use permit for anyone for a tier one or tier 2 and tier 3. So that’s up to this board here. If there’s You know, if there’s no pushback from the neighbors? And you guys see fit that it’s not a conflicting issue for land use. It’s not commercializing agricultural property.

00:08:08,600	Which is what this is not intended to do at all. We have to prevent that because we have to preserve agricultural property as it is. It’s one of the least restrictive districts in our ordinances and there’s a reason for that because. Farming is pretty, pretty standard. It’s, it’s, we don’t, we never had this come before us. It’s not that we’re opposed to.

00:08:30,100	I’m not opposed to it. I don’t have any personal opinions on this, but there’s a threshold that we cannot allow it to cross over and that’s. Uh, tricky Tricky to prevent. So And the threshold you’re referring to is the difference between agriculture and commercial, commercializing agricultural land.

00:08:54,570	Yeah Are there any questions for Mitch before uh we, we, uh, move into the hearing. I’m, I’m sure we will have questions for you later also, uh, Comm. Risch, yeah. Uh, Mitch, thanks so much. Thanks, Comm., our Chair, the only question I have is uh at the last meeting there was concern about a corn maze, and now the corn maze has been built.

00:09:14,170	Is there any path forward through this for the Baldwin corn maze. To operate this fall. It’s already been planted and it’s there. Well, that’s why we’re here tonight. To try to get this through.

00:09:39,670	Um, that’s what the county board recommended, um, It’s It’s the, the problem is we’re we’re we’re tied to the legal notices and the links between those notices before an ordinance becomes effect. Um, It’s It won’t, if, if one of these, I don’t care which one you guys pick. If one of these are recommended approved, it goes to the commission on the 4th.

00:10:00,030	And whether they approve it or not, then if they do improve it, improve it, then it goes to, um, we have to publish it for 30 days. Before it becomes effective. Anybody in the world can can appeal that and contest that ordinance in that 30 days if there’s no appeals, then it becomes law.

00:10:21,130	Comes on ordinance So we’re, we’re kind of being a time constraint we’re trying to figure out if if there’s a possibility that we can get her permit or get this individual a permit in October. Um, It may be too late. I don’t know. We’re gonna, we’re trying to work through that.

00:10:41,230	We don’t want to break the law by not listening, by not, um, observing the, the scheduled time that these ordinances have to be heard by the public and have to be, you know, on our website and in the paper for 30 days. We cannot obfuscate that.

00:10:58,700	And so it’s, that’s the problem is, uh, you know, we’re trying to move it as fast as we can and I would say the the wheels of government should move slowly. They normally do slowly, and that’s why there was some confusion on tier 3. It’s because I included this in there because it it combined most of the the comments from that stakeholder meeting, both sides of the table. And that’s why I put it in there. We’re not, not saying that I’m.

00:11:21,800	Um, you know, trying to make 350 people a day out and some people’s pasture for corn maze. I’m not pushing that. I’m pushing for the flexibility of ordinances it flexibility of our zoning? To allow it if the court of public opinion says yes. Uh, Comm. Munsen, I think you had something.

00:11:43,100	Sure, um, Mitch, just a couple of clarifying questions before we get into the to the public. So in the, the descriptions or the definitions, agricultural recreation, why does it require a single family dwelling? Well, that was discussed in the cities, stakeholder groups, they, we, and we, we want to tie that to agriculture.

00:12:08,070	We don’t want to allow a corporate farm to come out there and start a corn race. They, they won’t be bothered with 350 people on their property today. They’ll be living off, so they might hire a manager to run it for them.

00:12:26,570	So it’s the idea that a farm is the is is owned by the and operated by the owner on site. And this corn maze is owned and operated by the owner. It’s his land and be more protective of it. That’s the intention. That’s what agriculture is.

00:12:44,970	I mean, it’s for, for, you know, just a slim definition of it, right, and I and I really didn’t want to tie it to the corn maze, but specifically that situation. That corn maze is not on. A piece of agricultural land with a home, is it? It is OK, there’s, yeah, there’s a home there, OK, but not their home.

00:13:08,030	They’re renting it Now I, I don’t know, you’d have to ask them, but I knew size are not living in the home where this property is being operated. You’d have to talk to the, to the owner and I know that that it’s gonna be operated by other people besides the owner, but it, but I, I, I don’t know I didn’t want to get into the specific corn maze. That’s not my point. My point is I don’t.

00:13:23,730	If, if I bought a 40 acre plot. And the purpose of that is for me to help educate agriculture. Why am I required to live there? Well, it’s I think it protects, it protects the land, it protects the the interest of the people in next door neighbors. It’s, it shows an ownership. It shows a.

00:13:54,000	You know, it’s, it’s part of operating a piece of property that you are in you you own and you want to keep it the way it is and you want to protect it and you don’t want to go overboard with it and it’s, I mean, that’s.

00:14:08,400	was up to the city of Bismarck and their stakeholder meetings, it was questioned there as well, but and so I like I said, I was just hoping for an explanation on that part. Second question, when we get into uh page 3 and we talk about agricultural recreation tier 2. 2 requires. 40 acres of land. In order for it to qualify in this ordinance, right? OK.

00:14:38,500	Does tier one require 40 or is it limit? Yeah, no, it, it can be, but again, um uh section one on the tier 3, section 1 A. 15 additional conditions may be included in the special if you want to go down to 10 acres, which can be in an ag district.

00:15:00,270	To allow for a strawberry patch for 50 people a day. My only recommendation for that is I did not include the number of days, the number of events. I think that that should be included because they could be. Bunker patch one month and something else the next month. Absolutely, if, if you had a, a even a 20 acre patch.

00:15:20,970	You could have strawberries, you could have an apple orchard, you could have a pumpkin patch, you could have and all of those items are going to come into season differently. Oh yeah, yeah, and it’s um most of them are 30 days each, you know, I mean apples for 2 weeks whatever, but they’re um it’s designed to allow that.

00:15:39,170	Flexibility If somebody wants to have a strawberry patch. The family wants to have a strawberry patch on their 40 acres. They can’t. Now if it’s up to this board to reduce that to 10 acres if you want, OK.

00:16:03,230	There is flexibility in tier 3 and or uh the third version, but it’s the You know, we don’t want to stifle people’s dreams, third question and then I’ll, then I’ll be done. So the USDA, uh, their definition of agriculture or a farm, if you will, is uh Something that is producing $1000 a year in income. That qualifies with the USDA to become a farm. We don’t have any of that language in here. So should it.

00:16:30,530	Well, it’s, it is questionable if the 10 acre. 10 acre lot can can produce enough income in our ordinance is 51%. OK, to be exempt and we have never Ask for people’s.

00:16:56,500	The W-2s our tax returns we don’t ask for that, and I don’t wouldn’t want to ever it’s, you know, it’s, but there are many, many 10 acre parcels out there in this in this our in our jurisdiction that are Zone A. OK. Thank you, Comm. Sreifel. Thank you. That’s something. Uh, Mitch, I just had a quick question on version one and version 2, number 16 is there, but on version 3 it’s not.

00:17:15,200	Did it just get bumped from page to page and disappear or is it gone for a reason? I took that off. Uh, it’s already in section of Article 8. If, if there are any violations on the special permit or, you know, change of use, and it could be revoked.

00:17:37,500	And on that same line, if there are violations, who Who answers to those? Is it the Manager of the. You know, the operator of whatever is being special permitted, is it the owner of the land? It would be the owner. The owner of the land. Thank you. OK. Any other questions for Mitch before we get into this? Yeah, Comm. Risch. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

00:17:58,800	Uh, Mitch, getting back to the home dwelling portion, um, most farms, they have not continuous acres. I mean, they’ll have a quarter of land here, somebody else has got a quarter, another quarter over here.

00:18:18,100	So what happens if the home is on one quarter but they actually want to do this enterprise on another quarter over here and it’s not continuously connected. The houses here. Can they do it on the other quarter? Uh, that hasn’t been brought up, but. I would think it’d be, I mean, if they’re contiguous, absolutely, but I mean, if it’s in another township 50 miles away, I don’t know.

00:18:40,200	I mean, one of this one of the reasons is to prevent out of state ownership of this property too. And that’s, you know, the people, it’s the idea is that you have. A concern of this property, a major concern on this property, and you’re there to make sure it doesn’t go overboard. And become a problem for Burleigh County.

00:18:59,570	And the ideas, they’re not doing this for, for the sake of, of. You know, just asking people to come on their property. They want to make money off of this. And it’s in some cases they can make a lot of money if they’ve got 350 people a day coming out there. That’s a considerable amount of money.

00:19:19,770	And it’s Ideas that this is a a quain little operation is the ideas of the corn mace you have 50 people or 100 people come out. When you get up to 350 people, that is. Impacting that land use and impacting the roads and the neighbors and uh and Burley County.

00:19:40,570	So that I, you know, I don’t have a good answer for that, but you know, back to that home ownership, it’s a, it’s locking it to the ownership is locking it to that agricultural purpose. And You know, You could be a corporation out of out of completely out of town here. It’s. Open up a corn maze for 350 people. I keep going to Cormis.

00:20:01,630	It could be pumpkin patch. Yeah, it could, yeah, I’m sorry. It could be, uh, you know, it whatever it could be a balloon race. I don’t know. It could be something that somebody comes up with a really good idea that’s popular, that is, is, is making another pumpkin patch where 70 80,000 people a year are going to

00:20:19,830	these things and so it’s. Um, You know, we’re I, I’m, I’ve I’ve been trepidatious on this ordinance from the very beginning because I don’t want to create something that is going to spin out of control. OK, yeah, Comm. just one follow up.

00:20:43,630	So if this passed through the commission and got enacted, would we be able and an applied to Papa’s pumpkin patch, but I guess it doesn’t cause that’s in the ETA but would something like pop is punk and Patch be allowable under tier 3? No. What? No, no. But we wouldn’t have another problem where the flexibility comes in and a decision at this meeting here.

00:21:02,300	If you say, OK, it stopped at 100 or 150, no more than 150 people per day, which is a lot of people a day. If it goes over that, they have to go to a PUD. PUDs are a heavy lift. They, they are, uh, they go through much more scrutiny, but you cannot revoke their beauty.

00:21:23,700	It’s an absolute zoning change and if they follow the strict guidelines of what that PUD was established as they could continue forever like Papa’s Pumpkin patch.

00:21:43,300	If they change it or alter it or add 1000 people a day out there or whatever, then that may go out of the guidelines of that PUD which, which is a design ordinance, basically it’s a kind of a forest for a singular. singular piece of property that has multiple uses on it. Like Papa’s Pumpkin patch. And, or, you know, like the uh. Bucksta Junction, that is a PUD. So Right, uh, yes, uh, Comm. Connelly.

00:22:13,470	If nothing was changed and it was how it was today, the special use permit and the PUD would apply currently too, right, based on how you described it. Uh, no, especially use permit is is for. Anything that’s on this list here. And anything else that’s allowed by their district. And they are. They’re kind of, they’re singular. Landfills are especially use permit.

00:22:37,670	Now if they want to open up a carnival on that land, property, landfill they wouldn’t be able to. And it’s come back here or get their their special use would be provoked. Um, we’ve never, we have not revoked any special use permit, but there was, there was a request, um,,, 34 years ago to close the landfill on their special use permit.

00:22:58,030	Um, but they weren’t violating it. They were following state standards, and so we this board, the county board just said, you know, they determined that they did not want to cancel that special use, but if this goes out of hand, any of these gets out of hand, they can. We’d have to come back to the table here.

00:23:16,330	Yeah Any other questions for Mitch before we start? Oh yeah, Comm. Sreifel, um. There was some concern out there that this would affect current Burley County, um, activities that are already going on, but there’s nothing out there that is currently under special use permit that this wouldn’t, this, that this would affect, right?

00:23:36,430	Not that I’m aware of. I, I haven’t heard of any. You know, Nothing like that’s on this list here. Thank you. All right, anything additional for Mitch? All right, Mitch, we’ll let you off the hook for now and we’ll likely have more questions. Yes, thank you. Thank you for clarifying.

00:24:02,100	We will move into the public hearing, uh, this public hearing is, uh, so we’ll open the public hearing, this public hearing is an amendment to the Burley County zoning ordinance, uh, Article 8, Special uses, Section 28, Agriculture, recreation.

00:24:25,500	Uh, this amendment includes amendments to Article 3, the definitions, and Article 11 agricultural district regulations, Section 3 permitted uses and Section 4 special uses. Uh, as I said before, um. Uh, please, uh, approach the lectern if you would like to speak in this hearing, uh, make sure that you do, uh.

00:24:43,800	Give us your name, where you’re from, and uh please sign in, uh, I, I believe the uh the piece paper or the clipboard is up on the podium, and um, yeah, everyone, uh, if you would like to take up to 5 minutes to speak, uh, please approach the lecture in this hearing. Mhm Good evening commissioners. I guess I’ll be the one to break the ice, but, uh, I send the one at the back.

00:25:12,670	Is that fine? Oh, please sign this one if, if you’re going to speak and then just your name and and where you’re from. My name is Steve Krantz. From Baldwin And basically I just want to start off by saying I oppose this zoning ordinance. And I thought I’d get some clarity tonight just to.

00:25:30,070	Understand kind of how it all fits together because when I read the ordinance, the zoning. It’s confusing to me. There’s a lot of trapdoors in my opinion, a lot of catch-alls. And finding out that we have 3 different Versions that we’re reviewing. Her approval I think I’ve justified To me, the zoning ordinance is unnecessary.

00:25:52,030	The county commission has a process to allow. Variances of existing zoning ordinances. Whether your egg Rural residential, etc. To me, I think those processes work well and I think could be continued to me this addition to the zoning ordinance. Creates a lot of confusion, and I’m gonna Maybe Clarify something.

00:26:17,530	To me, I read into this, this creates unue oversight and unfairly dictates how farmers deliver their crops and produce to the public. Whether a farmer puts a crop on the truck and hauls it to town. Or invites customers out to pick. Shouldn’t matter. It’s own egg that’s an agricultural practice. To me, I was reading some stuff into the zoning. If I hold a trail ride.

00:26:36,130	I have to follow Zoning, new zoning ordinance. It’s identified trail rides they have to be zoned and permitted. To me that’s oversight. That’s if I want to invite friends over. That should not need a permission slip from the county to do so. But according to the new zoning that would.

00:26:56,200	Uh The way this is written and it appears anything outside the actual raising of livestock, cultivating and producing crops will require the county. Permission. This is too restrictive and will hinder entrepreneurship. I don’t believe that the commission envisioned that this, that as a consequence when this was developed.

00:27:18,500	You can utilize your existing authority in issuing special use permits and PUDs to evaluate each situation on its merits and stop creating unnecessary regulatory processes for the public, so. Any questions? I’ll try to answer them. Any questions for Steve? Uh, seeing none, thank you, Steve. Thank you. If anyone else would like to uh approach and speak in this public hearing, please uh feel welcome. Good evening.

00:28:06,900	My name is Mary Pole. And I’ll get this signed in here. So you all know I’m the corn maze person. But I’m also the Christmas tree person. And I am also the Flora Cloer person and I am also the you pick because I mentor new and upcoming farmers.

00:28:43,200	So I’m speaking for a lot of different things and uh not just the corn maize. Now if you want to ask me about that, I, I will certainly outside of my 5 minutes, uh, address that. I also turned in my draft notes, um, because I did not realize it was Monday morning when they were due, uh, and I’ve been told.

00:29:01,270	advised that there were some words in there I shouldn’t have used, like never use angry. Um, it doesn’t come across well when you’re a female, uh. True, true advice that came from somebody in politics. Um, So I’ve never been through this process before, um, and I’m learning a lot and.

00:29:23,770	I have 7 points and I, I’ll go through those. I believe that some of the things in this language conflicts with other areas in the Burleigh County zoning ordinance. 2, I believe it creates a burdensome permitting process and adds fees unusually high for the return on investment.

00:29:48,870	It targets a small segment of agriculture that includes beginning and new farmers and as well as those farmers diversification bringing young people back to the farm and they need a little bit more cash flow. Number 4, it reduces the ability and the desire to host education activities on the farm. Ag Education will decrease, will have to decrease because the language adds confusion to defining recreation versus tourism versus education.

00:30:11,130	Um, and it limits education to one day. The languages this draft, point number 5, defines the impact of on-farm or pick your own harvesting methods differently than the more conventional thought of agriculture without consideration of the actual requirements for planting, harvesting, and marketing.

00:30:38,130	Number 6, the numbers used, whether it’s day or that one day or it’s 30 days or 50 people or 20,050 people. Um, those are kind of, um. Just picked up out of the air. Where’s the research? Where’s the charts that say this is the true impact to the things that you are responsible for safety, health, and infrastructure.

00:31:01,300	And then last, I may speak briefly to my own experience, um, of confusion and, um, And the and and the comment that we don’t want to be neighbor to neighbor, uh. Relationships or mediators and uh I have some suggestions. Uh, so I don’t come without suggestions. I, I always told that to my staff. Come to me with your complaints, but you better have some answers too.

00:31:24,800	Um, but before I, I get started in my points, um. So from Mitch’s comments, it sounds like we’re trying to protect from out of state sales, uh, moving from agriculture into commercial and letting neighbors have a big voice in in say, um. So we all hear want the same very same things we want to protect agriculture.

00:31:50,670	So I think that we need a better definition of agriculture, recreation, and I suggest that we look to the same definition that we have for A tourism, then it’s clear, and that’s as uh somebody told me that’s the experience, right? I don’t.

00:32:12,870	I don’t actually disagree with the corn maze maybe needing to be a special permit, but some of these other things I I vehementently um disagree with. So but staying on education. Um, Let’s see. So I better start with my bullet number one, conflicting sections, conflicting sections include the inclusion of the draft floor culture and on-farm markets which you already have defined in Article 7 youth groups and specific terms under

00:32:40,370	Section 15 truck farming. I would like to see that language removed from, from the draft ordinance. Floriculture and on-farm markets. Because there is no need for permits or fees, and it doesn’t do any of those things that you’re concerned about protecting from out of state sales, uh, commercialism, and we are protecting egg.

00:33:03,630	I still am very confused about the single farm farm dwelling, um, I grew up on a farm and we lived in town. And just saying, and I’m aware that sometimes that happens. We still do that.

00:33:26,530	I understand that that is a concept that you think that protects it from the out of state sales and commercialism, etc. but that is really confusing. Like, do I have to have it on my house? What if my 80 acres down the road. And then we get into even more confusing.

00:33:42,930	What if that 80 acres is in a different township? What if that 80 acres is in a township that says, yay, but I live in this township or vice versa. See where I’m going here a little bit conflicting with the, the house thing. Um, There aren’t fees listed in this language by point number 2. But my basic research and my experience says that it’s $300. That’s what’s on your forms, um.

00:34:06,900	It doesn’t really speak to being annual or permanent. I’ve, I’ve asked Mitch and on other things and it seems like sometimes that’s permanent. I’ve heard PUD language tossed around, that’s permanent. But many of these things are annual. And for example, the corn maze. Maybe a corn maze this year, but it may be hay next year.

00:34:27,000	Certainly in the rotation, we’re not going to have corn for 10 years. I’ve been a sole conservationist for too long to to have a, a monoculture, uh. Rotation. So, um, so again, it stays agriculture. And Mary, I’ll just have to have you wrap up the fees are confusing.

00:34:48,400	So that was, uh, my definition and like I said, you do have some of my language in there. But if nothing else, the language for education needs to change. The fees need to be identified, um, numbers need to be consistent.

00:35:08,870	And lastly, I will say, language could be more positive to agriculture in just this manner, uh, activity carried out on a farm or ranch that allows members of the general public to Experience should be allowed just in your, in your definition of agriculture, as long as it is protective, as long as it meets safety, health, and infrastructure, uh. They kind of needs and, and definitions. So no special permit, then agriculture isn’t moving into special permits.

00:35:33,470	So again, I thank you for the 5 minutes, it went really fast, um, as I said, I, I did come with some more additional language suggestions to make it a positive experience instead of a negative experience, uh, because I do believe that we do need some regulations, but they need to be clearly written. They need to be understood.

00:35:55,430	By both parties, the on and off parties and they need to make sense to safety, health, and infrastructure. Thank you. Are there any questions for for Mary before she steps away, Comm. Jarrett, yeah, yeah, um, I didn’t catch, are you from Baldwin? Yes, I am. Not the town I live in the country.

00:36:13,930	Yeah, OK, and then second is, are you against this ordinance, I am. All right. Any other, any additional questions for Mary? So, thank you, Mary. If anyone else would like to speak at this hearing? Uh, please do so. Chair Agnew, commission members. I’ll sign in here. My name is Clark Coleman. I am the person that. Um, planted the corn maize.

00:36:52,500	Uh, with good intentions, and I don’t really have a from Baldwin, right, yeah, that’s what I was thinking. OK, thanks. I really don’t have much of a comment except that I am against these ordinances and I’m up here to answer your questions.

00:37:09,300	Um, The crop rotation is a is one of the things that when you talk about land being on the farmstead or whatever or on that same quarter, there’s no way you can do it and keep it on the same land. You have to move it around. I, I’ve won awards for my farming practices and I didn’t win it by putting corn on corn on corn.

00:37:21,500	It’s one of the reasons why we moved it from Buck Stop Junction is because it had corn on it 5 years in a row, it was time. It was time to move to, to, to move it, so. Um, And then, you know.

00:37:40,500	We’re talking about numbers of people that can come in to example corn maze or any kind of a um fall activity. We all know what the weather’s like in North Dakota. We can have a October 5th with 75 degrees. Beautiful sunny day, and we can have 250, 350. How many, how many people in there on that Saturday? Or Friday and then on Sunday.

00:38:01,400	Where it’s raining or it’s cold or the wind’s blowing and we’ll get 5. We’ll get 5 people We have to be able to capitalize on that when the weather is good. One more point. This corn will get combined at the end of the year. I planted that corn maze with the same seed population that I see on any other land.

00:38:20,200	It’s just thicker where the, where it’s supposed to be thicker and where the walkways are, there’s no corn. It is going to be combined. I have to report it to my insurance company. I have a insurance, hail insurance on it. I have all that. It’s, it’s farm.

00:38:34,900	It’s just something for people to do walk in my cornfield. And we’ve already got several schools calling for their um. The day that they leave school wanting to come out and go to the corn maze and we can’t answer them. We can’t answer So I clarification tonight is very important for us, and I’d be willing to answer any questions that you might have.

00:38:56,970	All right, any questions for Clark? Yes, Comm. Munsen first, and I know this is going to be an off the wall question, but. Average Amount of people per car that would come to the corn maze. You probably never studied it. Yes, what’s the average size of a family? Mom, mom and dad, 2 kids, mom and dad, 3 kids.

00:39:20,470	Lot of date nights A lot of date nights, high school kids, two of them, uh, uh, boyfriend, girlfriend will come out there. Hey, this is our date night tonight. We’re just going to walk through the corn maze. Thanks for doing it.

00:39:34,470	You know, and during, during the, during the uh COVID year, the first year we did it, we thought, oh, should we do this? Should we do this? You wouldn’t believe how many people came through there and then afterwards they’d sit out there in the cars just because it was a beautiful day and I’d walk over you having car troubles? No, we live in an apartment.

00:39:47,070	We just needed something to do and we don’t want to go back to our apartment. Come on guys. We, we don’t make money, we don’t make hardly any money doing this. We really don’t. We, we really don’t. Any additional questions for Clark, uh, we’ll go to Comm. Risch. Thank you Mr. Chair Clark.

00:40:07,430	Did you have to need any special permits or zoning or anything in your previous corn mazes out by Bucks Stop Junction. No, we, we, I talked to, uh, I talked to Chris Kathleen Jones at the time.

00:40:22,630	I rented the land and I told Kathleen, I said, hey, this is my, my plan here, you know, maybe you should talk to the county and make sure that I can do this. They came back and said, yeah, we’d love to have it down there. We’d like to have the activity and stuff down there. But since then I’ve been informed that that is in city limits.

00:40:34,030	They already have an ROA, so I, I wasn’t required for permit there. I did, I, I just didn’t think we needed permit to do it here either. I just. It’s just part of my farming operation and we do it every year, you know, been doing it for, I think this will be the 7th year so.

00:40:49,630	And quite honestly, I, you know, I, I was looking for someone to partner with. It was too far from our farm and I, I was combining my wife was doing all the work and, and it just got to be too much and so then we decided to either quit last year or move it closer to home and then I contacted Mary and I said, Hey

00:41:02,200	Mary, you got a little bit of land over there. It’s a great fit, great fit. We partnered up and I planted the corn maze and then all this stuff started, so. Any additional questions? Yes, Comm. Streifel, is there a reason it’s not on your land instead of the Um.

00:41:26,200	There really isn’t except that we would have a parking issue, um, if, and I, I wanted to keep it on pavement so I wouldn’t have to deal with the gravel issue.

00:41:38,900	And so that limited a lot of our land and to be able to do that kind of a thing and that’s why Mary was such a or the greenhouse was such a nice fit for that. They’ve got adequate parking, more than adequate parking, you know, and uh um paved road to it, so I’m not we’re not dealing with the gravel and a lot of traffic and so it’s just, it’s just a, it’s just a good fit and for the most part, the neighbors are all, I mean,

00:41:55,470	they’ve all written letters to you guys saying that they support it. A lot of them here would be willing to testify, but that’s beside the point. This is the, the ordinance. The corn maze is a whole different issue. It’s a whole different issue, but I’m here to answer any questions if. If you need it.

00:42:11,470	Any additional questions for Clark? 4 steps away. Thank you. Hi, I’m Sarah Adi Coleman. Um, I, and I’m here wearing, um, my tourism and marketing hat. I just rolled in from Watford City. I didn’t think I would make it in time, but we concluded a little bit earlier. I’m the director of the Tourism marketing division.

00:42:48,270	I live in Bismarck. OK OK, yes, yes, live in Bismarck. Um, I, I just wanted to reiterate that I don’t think this policy works. I think the numbers are too low, um, in order to make it really viable for operators.

00:43:07,130	I was in, um, this Noon today, I was on a panel with, I think there were 8 of us who did a farm to fork panel at the Main Street summit, and the interest that there is out there for farm-related experiences throughout the whole state is, is really high.

00:43:28,730	And people are aware, they’re watching Brulioni, and they’re, they’re very interested and curious about how this, how this, um, pans out and what the results are because the policy options, you know, we, we, we just don’t, we just shouldn’t be Starting with no, we should be starting with yes and really figure out a way.

00:43:43,830	I think one of the biggest concerns I would have with the 75 is that if we were able to convince people to come for a special use permit, that would put you in a position of having to. Mitigate neighbor neighbor issues, which seems to be what you do a lot of, and I’m sure it’s not what you want to be doing.

00:44:02,700	I’m sure you would rather be looking forward and developing forward looking policy that would um help the the county both in terms of, you know, um, quality of life and economic viability. So I don’t, I didn’t have a whole lot else. I know I sent you all a letter, but I just wanted to, in case you had any questions since I was able to make it.

00:44:17,100	All right, any questions for Mary? Or excuse me, Sarah. Read the wrong one, for Sarah before she steps away. seeing none. Thank you, Sarah. Hi, my name is Sheila Zacher, and I live in Bismarck, North Bismarck. And this is kind of in my opinion, a continuation on a special use permit that we, I spoke out against previously.

00:44:57,470	This ordinance has kind of Come on to that, um, my concerns is I’m not against agricultural expansion, doing the diversification. My concern is how about those neighbors that are in close proximity. They’re going down their roads now. They’re doing dust, they have so many other concerns. And I just, to me.

00:45:26,070	I’m not against them trying to do things. But when they’re trying to commercialize it in that, in my opinion, that’s what they’re kind of doing. And if they want to do that to an extent of having events every day or even half the days out of the year, or every weekend out of the year.

00:45:44,770	At what point does that not become a commercial property, then I think they need to get it rezoned. That’s just my personal opinion. So I am against the, um, the ordinance as far as it being. Opening up the door for commercial opportunities. Because people moved into the country.

00:46:06,830	Yes, there’s farmers out there, but other people have purchased property out there as well. And I just don’t believe that they should have to be subjected to the other things that are going to happen as a result of these types of ordinances. Personal opinion. Thank you. Uh, any, any questions for Sheila? Uh, seeing none, thank you, Sheila. I do have 00, yes, uh, Comm.

00:46:42,830	Jet, um, so are you against this ordinance or for it? I’m Against I am, yes, I am against the ordinance in the tier 3, giving it. When you’re starting to allow multiples like In the 2 or 3, it specifically states the commercial, and then it’s anything over 75.

00:47:11,500	My concern is that when you go to special use permits and so forth, is is that that all becomes subjective. Who’s going to review those? Who’s going to permit those, you know, um, is it going to be consistent? There’s a lot of questions that need to be answered in I think before something like this is actually passed.

00:47:33,600	I mean, I personally had reviewed 3 revisions of this and got the 3rd 12 days ago and was very surprised to see language that in my opinion was from the very first initial stakeholders meeting where that tier 3 was kind of. Taken out of the equation.

00:47:55,400	So, um, you know, I did send you guys my comments and so forth, so um those are just, that’s how I feel about it and um, I guess, um, I was more comfortable with version one. Of the versions and um. That’s all I got to say. Anything else? OK, any other questions for Sheila? Done here. Thank you, Sheila. If anyone else would like to approach the uh the podium, please do.

00:48:38,000	Good evening, commission. Um, my name is Dian Zan. I live in Bismarck, but I have property near Baldwin. Um, I will apologize in advance to you guys as well as the people here. I am a little late to the party as far as, um, Understanding this process.

00:49:02,470	Um, my first question, because this may be a bit of a challenge without knowing. Am I allowed to ask you guys questions. Is that acceptable? We can, uh, uh, you, uh, you have the floor.

00:49:23,170	OK, so one of the questions that came to mind for me, and this is just the fact of what can I do with my property at some point, um, so this is where I thought this now matters to me. So, Comm. Mun Munsen, um, you had made a comment on the news that and, and I may not have gotten it completely right and so I was looking for clarification that if you had an apple orchard. And you wanted to have people come pick apples.

00:49:44,470	I thought you said that’s illegal, is that I’m looking for clarification on that. So ordinances are written. To allow people to perform. Their business or perform. Yup pick orchard. If you don’t have an ordinance in place, you cannot do it. But that’s, that’s what what’s hard is agriculture. Believes I own the land.

00:50:11,130	I can do whatever I want. My goal is to make sure we have ordinances so that we can do them and so you’re right, I made the statement that way and that’s correct. We want an ordinance in place so that we can allow these activities. So this ordinance that’s in front of me.

00:50:35,230	We, we do currently today have an agricultural recreation ordinance then, or is this whole thing new? Is this a brand new document? Mitch answer that one. It’s not an interactive yet. This is new. It’s on a draft. All, every one of these are under draft right now. Because when it said amending Article 8 of the 1972.

00:50:56,000	So you’re just talking the whole zoning ordinance all encompassing that. This is an amendment to that ordinance. This is just one piece of it, so, um, OK, again, I apologize, maybe I missed a piece is that is is if there is a business transaction in, in place.

00:51:13,300	This doesn’t, this doesn’t mean you can’t have someone come pick apples off. Of your tree. There has to be a business transaction for this to be uh agritourism. As, as I as I understand it, correct me if I’m wrong. Mitch, is that correct? They are I don’t know if you can hear me.

00:51:35,200	The, uh, the ordinances in intent is to allow larger groups of of customers coming into your property. Now under normal agricultural pro you know, it’s. You can grow apples and have people pick them. Or you can sell them on a on a truck farm. We can sell them on a roadside stand too.

00:51:54,670	It’s in the ordinances, but the minute you start charging for an event on your property such as. Uh, you pick or um name it, I mean, under, it’s could be anything corn maize, hayrides, it could be anything. The minute you start charging for that admission and, and it’s a regular basis and it’s more than. 7500 people, then the, the uh should get a permit for that.

00:52:16,570	Thanks for the clarification, Mitch, uh, uh, yeah, uh, Comm. Risch, I need a little clarification. Now, I would never do it, but I think people sometimes charge people to hunt on their land.

00:52:36,070	Is that against the law because we don’t have an ordinance on it? I don’t want to I don’t want to start I mean, I mean that stuff goes on out there and. I think it’d be news to most people it’s against the law. Mr. Chair. So yes, the intent of the ordinance is if it is on a regular basis. Of more than 10 times a year or 15 or whatever, 20 times a year and it’s.

00:52:56,130	Where you’re charging money for people to come on your property than that in some people’s minds is commercializing egg property. And if I, I don’t have the numbers. I mean, it’s, it could be 50 times a year. It could be 30.

00:53:13,430	I don’t, I’m not saying those numbers, but the idea is that if you’re on a regular basis and you’re charging and making a transaction to allow a complete stranger on your property to do an activity there that is. In in some people’s mind that’s commercializing your egg property. In the DN I don’t wanna, we don’t want to have us take up all of your time so please, please no, that’s OK.

00:53:35,530	I appreciate the, the dialogue because I guess having the clarification of the, the money exchange, which I don’t think this ordinance discusses that at all, but, um, several years ago, and they did not charge, but um. But there are other counties that do charge for threshing shows.

00:53:54,500	So if you wanted to have that on your property, which is usually 1 or 2 day event with, with more than 75 people, um. This probably wouldn’t work, but um. I think it’s in Emmons County and there are other counties across the state of North Dakota that do that has during this process, did anybody look at what those counties do as far as cause this is not the,

00:54:16,300	you know, the Braddock couple weeks. They have a big threshing show down there that um. My son thinks he’s gonna have one, and I’m like, well, I, I don’t know, but based on this, you’re not, so that that’s why I’m here. It’s like I need to get more clarification on what this, I mean.

00:54:35,200	And let me go back to the original corn maze. So today, somebody can come up and ask. The county commission, that’s where it started, right? So you can get ask for a request. I wanna have this event and this event was denied, is that, is that accurate? The their special use permit was denied.

00:54:59,770	I am I accurate there? Yeah, yeah. It was the zoning part, not the county commission meeting. Now and correct me if I’m wrong, Mitch, but The State’s attorney said. That we can’t actually. Issue the permit because we don’t have an ordinance in place to issue.

00:55:21,970	So part of the situate, part of the reason for this ordinance is getting it in place is so that we can issue those special use permits. And, and that’s one of the reasons I really look forward to this, this ordinance in place because if you’re at whatever the number is, if we choose today that uh and and Burley County Commission agrees 75 or 150,

00:55:40,870	whatever that number is for the quantity of people. Then the special use permit comes in play. Then The highway department gets a chance to look at the road and see what the impact is on the road.

00:55:58,030	We get to look and listen to the neighbors to see what kind of impact is there so that we can make a decision based on that, but as it stands now, we can’t make that decision because we don’t have an ordinance in place. So you mentioned Papa’s Pumpkin Patch previously. So why is that OK if it’s in the Bismarck ETA? And, and the minute you get out of DTA it’s not OK. I don’t understand that.

00:56:19,530	They are already a PUD, a planned urban development, so they have went through all of the processes with the right officials for their land to be zoned, UD for that very specific purpose. And so they had those people that run that had to request a special use permit for that that’s actually not a special use permit.

00:56:41,130	That’s a rezoning. It’s a reed for that, I see. OK. Um, I think that is all my questions, um. I mean, I understand the concerns when you start talking. A lot of people coming down the roads and the dust. I mean, I get it and it gets to be, but.

00:57:06,100	How many people complain about it at Papa’s Pumpkin Patch. I mean, sometimes you have to weigh the benefits and as other people have spoken here today, um, to get your kids out of the house to do an activity that lets them enjoy the outdoors. I think it’s priceless today compared to, um, You know, the example of the apartment.

00:57:27,700	I mean, so I just think the less government is involved, the better, um, and I guess if you have to have an ordinance to get a special use permit, but, um, And I get the neighbor complaint, but it’s almost like to to put such stringent things in place. I mean, the single family, I mean, I think.

00:57:50,500	That’s a little touchy because somebody could really nitpick that apart if they really wanted to, so I guess you have to have an ordinance, but to me it’s almost like it’s. It’s a case by case basis.

00:58:08,300	I don’t think that there’s a one shoe fits one size, you know what I’m saying, um, that fits I’ll just have to cut you off there and ask, are there any additional questions for Dean? Yeah, yeah, Comm., are you against this ordinance or for? I’m against it the way that it is, I guess I’m for an ordinance if it’s required by law, um. Any, any additional questions? Yeah, yeah, Comm..

00:58:33,700	It’s not a question, it’s just a statement. I appreciate you coming up and asking all the questions that probably a lot of people are thinking, because this has been a very confusing process, so I appreciate you having the guts to come up and ask the questions. Thank you. Yeah. Any additional questions, comments, uh, for Dean? Not seeing any, thank you.

00:59:04,070	Thank you. Would anyone else like to speak at this public hearing. I’ll sign in after Keo so um. behind me because now I have questions if I have time with your name and where are you from? Yeah, hello commissioners. My name is Marie Horning. For those of you that know me.

00:59:43,070	I do live in Apple Creek Township currently, which is in Bismarck, is my address, and I would not be affected by this ordinance because I live in Apple Creek. But I’m also part owner of land in other townships in Burleigh County. So that’s why it’s important to me. And I kind of two things I want to speak to. First is your process.

01:00:01,730	I just questioned who was the stakeholder group? Do you as individual commissioners know who came to those meetings. Were you ever provided a list? Did you attend? I have no idea to where to look to even find out. Who was in the meeting, the minutes of the meeting. Anything.

01:00:23,030	That I never, you know, I didn’t figure out where to figure it out, you know, um, I also wondered about the 5 organized townships that are affected by this, so there’s 5 organized townships, and that’s it. So my first question is, were the supervisors asked to be stakeholders or asked if they knew any residents that might be interested.

01:00:46,330	And interestingly enough, The supervisors for your townships are listed on the Burleigh County website under government and townships, and they all are there. So you could email them or you could have called them. So they that didn’t happen, that seems kind of weird. Because it affected him once again there’s only 5 organized townships, Comm. Bittner. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I’ll address that.

01:01:08,800	Um, organized townships have their own zoning. So any ordinances that they are approved at this uh county planning commission only apply to to unorganized townships where Burleigh County sits as the township board of supervisors, so. Oh, well, I wouldn’t, there’s no need to contact other township supervisors.

01:01:28,000	Now if we were if we were proposing an ordinance under the Home Rule Charter. That would be a a horse of a different color, but just for clarification, um, this is for unorganized townships or townships that are organized that have uh Uh, delegated their zoning authority to the county. OK, so I would refer then to page 36 of your zoning ordinances. In section one, county zoning jurisdictions.

01:01:53,670	Burley County has zoning jurisdictions over the following townships, Burt Creek, Croft, Fort Rice, Gibbs, Glenview, Hay Creek, Riverview, Florence Lake, Minoan, Phoenix, Lyman and Canfield. Of those 12, 5 of them are organized. They even meet Two of them croftton Glenview, split Baldwin. And they meet, you know how I know? I’ve been to their meetings.

01:02:23,070	So they’re supervisors are involved. One of them’s here. Was he asked to be a stakeholder? That’s my point. Oh no, I’m gonna run out of time. OK, so that’s that point. Now my thing is your ordinance got about 3 minutes, so you’re good.

01:02:43,270	Uh, my question is, under the definitions, agriculture, recreation, why do you have the last eight words and in conjunction with a single family dwelling. If you take the time to drive out to the 12 townships of this ordinance will affect, you will find agriculture production going on without a single family dwelling. You might even find a barn, a tool shed, but no single family dwelling.

01:03:00,930	I would ask that that get removed. You can find the definition of a single family dwelling in your ordinance book. Under definitions, I do believe. Um, under decoration, agriculture recreation tier 2. It says tier 2, agriculture, recreation use shall not exceed an occupancy of 75 people per day up to 30 set events a year.

01:03:24,330	Why only 25 more people than tier one would not doubling it make more sense or tripling it? It seems weird that you just added 25 more people to 20 to tier two. Agriculture, recreation Tier 3. The definition should be written more like Tier 1 and tier 2 with the whole definition kind of is one sentence.

01:03:44,430	Um, where tier 1 and tier 2, there’s some periods after the usage. Now this might be the wrong version. I was unaware there were 3 versions. Um, in tier 3, I had written down that the words involve the gathering in tier 1 and 2 that doesn’t appear at the end of the paragraph, you use the word individuals.

01:04:02,000	It’s not used other places, the word people’s used. And again, the 75 numbers used I would again ask you to think about increasing that because it seems. Very low. The phrase assembled for the common purpose, these words don’t appear in the other tiers. I think that might be gone.

01:04:19,000	Tier 3 should use the same as the other tiers in the ending, basically, in their statements. Um, I also wrote down the definition of an event is a single day. How does that work on a Yi orchard that might be doing like Friday, Sunday, so when there’s this event, one day I have to get a permit for Friday, Sunday, Saturday.

01:04:36,000	I didn’t quite understand what an event is. Um Do do do. Oh, then I have the statement again, that again. In tier one, on page 3 of my copy, you have that, um, single-use dwelling again, but this time the owner has to occupy the dwelling.

01:05:00,170	I don’t know what that was about, um, I wrote down the lots sizes, or excuse me, the acreage that you have to have 40 acres or 35 because, you know, the continuance and all that that, um, Comm. was speaking to, but I believe in your current ordinances, a farm can be as small as 10 acres. So that’s sort of weird.

01:05:23,370	Um, Yeah, so I’m against, I’ll just answer that against the ordinance as currently written because, um, it seems strange and poorly written, um, and then I just wrote things now. How am I doing on time? I’m over. Oh, you’re right there. OK, well, I’m still gonna ask this question. About larger groups because I was questioning her question.

01:05:42,370	This is only going to apply to me if I charge. Yes. So if I invite Burley County 4H to come to my farm that I own. I do not live there, mind you, I live in Apple Creek. And we’re going to learn about. Texturing soil. As long as I don’t charge for each. I can do whatever I want.

01:06:09,430	But if I charge because I have supplies when I texture the the soil and they’re paying me back, or maybe they’re paying me a buck a kid or something, then I have a problem. I guess, uh, Mitch, if you would like to clarify that, Mr. Chair, the um You’d fall in a tier one. OK.

01:06:32,330	It’s allowed you if you’re educating school children? Absolutely if they’re refunding, you know, reimbursing you for expenses, that is, that’s not a commercial activity. We don’t want to confuse the two.

01:06:53,900	OK, which, what is what? But It would say 50 people a day in Burley County alone, we have over 200 registered for Hers last year, so I couldn’t actually invite Burley County out, but, um, yeah, so that’s just like one example of 75 people on education is not a very high number, so. I don’t get the ordinance. I don’t understand the process of the stakeholders. I think maybe now there’s more people informed and you should form another stakeholders group or have a public meeting that’s mediated.

01:07:15,900	Uh, any, uh, any questions for Marty Mitch, did you or Marie, Marie, sorry. I got that wrong. The education is not limited. It’s the idea is if you’re gonna have a U pick or a. An event Story of Patch, whatever you, you, that’s the limit of 50 people without a special use permit.

01:07:40,300	The education was not meant to be limited. You can easily get 50 kids on a school bus, I think I I used to be able to do when I was a kid, but that’s, that’s not, that’s not the intent of this order is, is to restrict educational events that’s uh.

01:08:00,400	But isn’t that what tier one says is any agriculture-related activity in conjunction with agriculture production, which is intended to educate the public in a singular one day event about agriculture. So separate section that’s a s and then section 2. So if I have 4H come out, we’re learning about soil, that’s an event. Because I’d probably advertise it on Facebook.

01:08:21,600	Because we often have things, people that aren’t registered for come to 4H events. So if I advertise it on Facebook. I could have more than 50 people show up at my event. Right. But I’m not going to charge. Yeah, your or your ordinance is kind of poorly written, and that’s OK, that’s what you’re here for today is to dig through it.

01:08:40,600	Any additional questions for Marie? All right, seeing none, thank you. I’m breaking the rules. I’ll, I’ll, I’ll ask, is there anyone else who would like to speak, um, prior to, uh. To, uh, someone coming up for the 2nd time. Uh, please, please do. I’ll, uh, I’ll. We want to get everyone through, give everyone a chance, so.

01:09:23,870	Hello, I’m Heather Lang. Um, I’m here on behalf of Berleoni Farm Bureau, and I live in Sterling. Just sign in here quick. OK. Um, thank you for allowing us to speak today.

01:09:52,730	I do, um, really appreciate it because I think, as you guys have heard, there’s a lot of clarification that needs to be heard about this um ordinance today. So one of the first things that I’m going to bring up is the definition of event. It is written. A planned single one day public or social occasion. So Does that mean I can’t have my family gatherings. I can’t do my forage events or farm tours, anything like that.

01:10:25,530	Now listening today, tonight, it’s if I’m charging for that. I guess, is how that’s defined. Um, then I’m gonna have issues, but if I don’t charge, then we don’t have issues. Again, that’s not how the ordinance is written, so it’s very confusing.

01:10:45,530	Um, another confusing part of that would be how we determine the numbers on each of the tiers. I’m not sure how those were determined. I would love some clarification on that. And then under the permanent uses section B. It says the duration and number of number of events must be stated on the permit.

01:11:12,200	Well, I just want to know how you accurately accurately know how many events you’re going to have a year. If I’m only applying for this permit once a year. How do I know how many events I’m having. OK. Um, and then also I would love to a a definition of a regular basis. Mitch keeps saying on a regular basis, on a regular basis.

01:11:41,900	I’m, I’m just not clear what that regular basis means is that Weekly is that biweekly, is that monthly? What, what does that mean? I’m not sure, Mr. Chair, yes, Mitch, go ahead the intent of the ordinance is to allow people to come onto your property any day of the week, every day of the week for up to 30 or 35 days.

01:12:04,770	That’s the intent. If you’re having a 4H event one time. This in this ordinance doesn’t apply. If you’re if you’re having a training session one time or 2 times, even 3 days, this ordinance would not apply. The idea is when you cross over a threshold and you allow people complete strangers to drive up to your property.

01:12:28,070	And allow them to come on your property for a fee. That’s what this ordinance is, is intended to to allow. So it’s The idea is that it’s a regular continuance or a regular basis of 1 day, 5 days, 25 days, 30 days. Does that make sense? Not exactly.

01:12:53,130	I’m still not understanding what regular means, because I think regular to you and regular to me and regular to someone else could be totally different things. So I might have a multiple events if that’s what you want to call them, um, on my, on my property, whether that be 4H events, whether that be, I mean, I do advocate for agriculture all the time on our,

01:13:14,330	I don’t charge people, they come out. Um, so I’m just not sure what a regular basis This means So if we could look further into that, that would be tremendous, Mr. Chair, that would fall under tier one. OK Um, I, I will just say Burlicone Farm Bureau completely opposes this ordinance as written.

01:13:40,630	We will support aro tourism all the time. So this completely restricts agro-tourism. And I guess, um, I will leave you with remarks of Agriculture runs our state. It runs a beautiful state of North Dakota. I don’t understand why we are trying to restrict agro-tourism and the industry that runs our state.

01:14:05,700	This ordinance there is so much restrictions on it. And I just wish that we could look at it a little bit further in depth and get a lot of clarification out of this. Are there any questions? OK, any questions for Heather? Seeing none. Thank you. Thank you.

01:14:32,300	Right, if anyone would like to approach the mic and speak in the hearing, please do. Good evening, commissioners. My name is Jamie Feist. I am, uh, a resident of Baldwin. And the neighbor to a proposed special use permit. Um, According to Article 11, agricultural district is established as a district in which the principal use of land is for general agricultural use.

01:15:11,770	The regulations are intended to prohibit commercial and industrial usages of the land. Um, A lot of these special uses, especially this agritourism would fall under Article 7, Section 7, as a commercial recreation group. Um, the definition of a commercial recreation group which is under um commercial zoning regulations.

01:15:42,470	Uh, commercial recreation group is a use in the commercial recreation group is one in which the principal activity is the furnishing of recreation for a profit. That is not an egg use. I did attend all the stakeholder meetings actually the first stakeholder meeting and the third stakeholder meeting. I was unable, unable to attend the second stakeholder meeting.

01:16:09,330	Um, one thing that concerned me is there was a large volume, 4 or 5, Department of Commerce employees there. That uh made their points known and they were vocal that uh they do not want any restrictions. They want uh. Basically free reign. Um, They don’t want a limitation on people. They want to be able to have however many people that they want there, um.

01:16:36,030	It was addressed earlier why why this was not put on Coleman land, um. It could have been put on Coleman land. He said he did not want to deal with gravel or anything like that. This could have been moved a 1 mile and a half down the road, same paved road.

01:16:53,300	Exactly the same, everything, um, there’s a 13 acre parcel. On Coleman land, um, parking lot there, larger parking lot than Baldwin Greenhouse, um. It would have been a perfect fit. They would have no neighbor issues. There’s no surrounding properties, coal mines and all the ground around there. There’s no livestock there. There’s no neighbors, there’s no nothing. I guess my.

01:17:15,300	My theory on why it isn’t there is it’s easier to host a party and somebody else’s backyard, and then your own because you don’t have to deal with the mess. You don’t have to deal with the disturbance.

01:17:29,800	And quite frankly, Clark’s brother Kurt probably did not want that in his own backyard, so it’s instead it’s going to be in my backyard, um. Another thing is way out of line. Another thing that I think needs to be addressed is Sarah Arie Coleman is speaking as the department. Is your state tourism director for the Department of Commerce and uh. That represents a conflict of interest here because she’s she’s wearing this hat. Comm.

01:18:00,800	Munson, yeah. I understand the. Personal situation here, but we’re here to work on an ordinance. Ordinance language. Very specific. If you have something with ordinance language, please give us some ideas how to make this better. OK, this, this was just my.

01:18:28,500	I guess me explaining to you that she was vocal about ordinance language, not wanting a restriction of 75 people at the first planning and zoning commission, she had stated at 75 people per day is not worth our time. This does apply to that language. She, she wants unlimited access, unlimited number of people to do her agritourism.

01:18:53,570	She is our tourism director, but she also wears the hat of she’s also the Coleman corn maze. Entrepreneurs, so to speak, because she will gain financially from this if there’s a restriction of 75 people, that’s less money they can make if they can bring 400 to 2000 people a day, which is what they originally had recommended or or they projected as a daily attendance.

01:19:15,970	You can make a lot more money with 400 to 2000 people a day, so. There’s definitely a conflict of interest there, um, the basic criminal conflict of interest statute. 18 USC subsection 208 prohibits government employees from participating personally and substantially in official matters where they have a financial interest. She has a financial interest in this.

01:19:42,770	She does not want these regulations because that will regulate the amount of money she can make from Miss Cormas. It, it is a valid point. And It can’t be brushed away because it it is a valid point. Those those Department of Commerce employees. We’re very vocal at the stakeholder meetings. They do not want regulation.

01:20:08,430	They want free rein and if it affects the neighbors, it’s no big deal because It’s, it’s more money they can make. There’s been a lot of confusion as to what agriculture is versus commercial use of egg land. OK, agriculture, we have a 5 acre cornfield here. Let’s say Clark gets 100 bushels an acre.

01:20:28,930	So it makes 500 bushel yield on that 5 acre field. 500 bushels of corn at $4 a bushel, which is higher than what it currently is. He would make $2000 on that 5 acre field. Which is basically $400 an acre. Before his expenses are taken out now if we do commercialized use of that egg land, he can take that 5 acre cornfield.

01:20:50,700	Let’s say he has 20,000 visitors over the period of time, so 20,000 visitors at a $10 admission is $200,000 on that 5 acre cornfield which equates to $40,000 an acre. That’s 100 times what the agriculture average is for our county. That is not agriculture.

01:21:17,800	That is commercial use of egg land, which is prohibited and it is your duty as Commissioners to Prohibit the commercialized use of egg lands. Hey Jamie, I’ll just have to cut you off there, um, and ask, are there any questions for Jamie before he steps away. I have, are, are you against or for the ordinance? Kind of both. I’m against the ordinance.

01:21:41,600	I don’t want the ordinance to pass because without an ordinance this problem goes away because without an ordinance there cannot be a permit. But I, I agree with some parts of the ordinance because there are restrictions on the number of people, so I’m kind of both ways without an ordinance, we don’t have to worry about a special permit being issued.

01:21:59,670	With the ordinance, at least there would be a cap of 75 people per day. In, in some instances, 75 people per day are OK in some instances it’s not because I did have an instance.

01:22:19,470	A week, not this prior weekend but the weekend before there were 5 teenage boys that went through that corn maze, loud screaming, hollering. And I did have injuries to my livestock that costs me a substantial amount of money that was 5 people. Now imagine 75 people every day, day after day after day. This will bury my farm. Because I don’t go to town and punch a clock. And earn an income.

01:22:44,670	Farming group Which is an approved egg use, so. Any damage or loss to these livestock. Affects me and my ability to provide. Are there any additional questions for uh Jamie, but yeah, Comm. Connelly. I know this is about the ordinance, but since that was brought up, um, and I watched the meetings that are on Dakota Media Access, um.

01:23:09,930	The special you use permit for this one, it was refunded until this conversation was being had and things, they can reapply for the special use under concurrent ordinances, right? Mitch, if you’d like to answer that.

01:23:30,130	The, the county commission had determined that because it did not write it specifically in our ordinances that they couldn’t issue a permit for it. It’s all in how you read the ordinances. So if nothing changes, though they could. Give it a whirl again to see if they could interpret it differently. Or is it a done deal? like he suggests I can’t predict or I wish I could.

01:23:49,630	I can’t predict what a county commission would determine, but I don’t, I don’t believe that they would move off of that position. I mean, it’s It was that was the finding or their findings of fact at that meeting. Right. Thank you. Yeah, uh, Comm. Munsen, yes. and if I can. That decision was based on the state’s attorney.

01:24:12,500	Telling us we could not rule on that or, or on that especially was permit. Thank you. Any additional questions? Um, I’m wondering, Mitch, if you could answer whether Article 7, Section 7 of commercial uses would be something that would cover the corn mace. It just if you research. You know, some of the information that’s out there, it appears that Baldwin Greenhouse is, is expanding.

01:24:40,600	And if that’s gonna all geared towards more commercial uses, would that be covered under Article 7, Section 7? Not a, not a zoned A. It’s not these uses, these um use groups are are, are applied to each district. And uh commercial recreation group is not allowed an egg. It’s, it’s more of uh.

01:25:03,670	You know, commercial That’s what it’s, you know, you, if you look under uh district, uh. Uh, for commercial district. Article. So Mitch, just to clarify what you’re saying is that uh it, it would if it were rezoned commercial.

01:25:34,670	Yeah, it could absolutely yes, if it was rezoned, um, the problem with rezoning just a straight commercial as they are now allowed to use any one of these use permits the uses that are permitted office, bank, church, gas stations. All that. Restaurants. So the idea is that If you look under each district, there will have the youth groups lined up and which on unlisted as which one is allowed in that district. OK.

01:25:56,430	Any additional questions for Jamie? See none, thank you. OK, thank you. If anyone else would like to speak at this hearing, please approach the microphone. Announce your name and where you’re from. Good evening, Tom Dutton from Minoan. Um, I am on the township board of Boyd. I’m on the Burley County Township Association. I am on uh.

01:26:47,230	Zoning association in our 3 townships, so I do have a little experience. But I find this terribly confusing. There’s not, they’re very little of this ordinance that makes any sense.

01:27:06,100	Where, where do you get off putting the number on them? You have no way of predicting how many people are going to show up in one day. And If 76 people show up, do you send that one person home? Who polices this? I find it very over restricting, um, Especially when you get into tier 3. If you’re gonna go. As far as uh roads, you have no, no.

01:27:43,200	Way of uh predicting what your roads are going to turn out to be. If there’s no rain, yes, there’s going to be dust. Uh, put chloride down to control the dust, $10,000 a mile. Right, Marcus I guess he’s left. Yeah. It’s $10,000 a mile. Well, How can a little Anthony Afford to do that.

01:28:12,600	And who makes the decision that it needs to be done? That’s the part that I don’t get, um. And as far as. As a resident being on such property. You know, You can’t have a home on every parcel of land you own. That’s just unreasonable. Too restrictive. Um, When you talk about. Denying the special use permit. If there’s not an ordinance in place.

01:28:46,200	Where do you get the right to deny it? If there’s not an ordinance, you’ve got nothing to rule on. Am I wrong? I don’t believe so. You have to have an ordinance in place. In order to deny something. Um. Clarification Paid hunting.

01:29:27,070	Would that fall under it? With a dog trial fall under it? As far as I’m concerned, that would be egg. People paying to run their dogs. Now, would a uh. Groping event Would that be Fall under this ordinance? If Arena had a roping or even if uh what if a horse club has, has a play day.

01:30:01,130	There’s a lot of things that need to be cleaned up on this thing. Um, I think That it was written in a rush. Trying to get ahead of something. But you’re late to the party. You can’t be done this fast. You’re trying to get it done by October. It’s uh so you can write a permit. Well. I don’t see it happening.

01:30:30,130	I don’t see that you can pass this. The way it’s written. There’s just too many things in it. that need to be changed and clarified. So That is my opinion. Any questions for me? All right, any questions for Tom? Seeing none. Thank you. Anyone else, anyone else would like to speak at this public hearing, uh, please approach the microphone.

01:31:26,900	Introduce yourself. Tell us where you’re from. My name is Heidi Grease. I’m from Baldwin. Um I guess to start off, I would say that I feel this is rushed also and confusing language and maybe just um For the reasons other people have already mentioned, conflicting information, um, confusing, um, I was at all of the stakeholder

01:31:56,770	meetings. I’m not sure how productive they were because it was a lot of just personal opinion. I think we should do this. I want you to take this word off. This would work for me. Um.

01:32:16,570	So maybe some more meetings with on a professional level that with a little bit less personal stake in it, but I do have questions and it’s in regards to Article 11 that was already mentioned, and that’s entitled Agriculture. District regulations, and it gives a description of what Ag District is. And in section 3, it says permitted uses. The following uses are allowed by right in an ag district, and there are, um, 13 things listed.

01:32:42,270	A structures and activities general farming, truck farming, those all sound, you know, obvious that they would be by right. But then when you have public recreation group, utility service group, radio, television transmitting station, uh, railroad line trackage, um, private golf course.

01:33:02,830	I’m just wondering how these lists were developed, how do these items get on this list? And then the next section is called Special uses. The following special uses are allowed in the Ag district in accordance with Article 8. And so if I’m understanding things correctly we’re changing Article 8 with this ordinance. So these 19.

01:33:25,230	Items will be affected because we’re changing Article 8, and these are the special uses that are allowed in an ag district. So again, not sure how this list came about, but they don’t seem very ag, actually, so. Um, airport, cemetery, drive-in theater, golf driving range, salvage yard, junkyard, vet animal clinic, solid waste disposal facility, vehicular race tracks, and number 12 rodeo and rodeo events, trap and skeet shooting, etc. so.

01:33:53,300	I do feel that this ordinance with section. Um, Article 8, sorry, very confusing. Um, will change, for example, the rodeo and rodeo type events that people and whether they’re applying for special uses already? To hold these events, whether it’s the mounted shooting clubs or the rodeo events or like was mentioned play dates, um.

01:34:19,800	Little Britches, rodeos, whatever it might be, they will be affected by this if, if, if I’m understanding all this correctly, would they not be affected? Because I’m pretty sure they have more than 75 people coming to the rodeo events and Unless I misunderstanding. Because it is confusing, Mr. Chair.

01:34:46,800	Yes, these are all these are special use permits that are applied for each individual one is applied for and is allowed use under a special use we would add a number 20 to that for agricultural recreation, and that would be uh that would not affect any of the other ones. They’re already in place. So they special use permits are permanent. They don’t have to reapply, so they could use whatever numbers they wanted.

01:35:09,070	They don’t have to go with the new numbers that are being proposed. Each, each one of these would be applied for on an individual basis. That, that we would not reference agricultural recreation for skeet shooting. Those are, that’s a separate special use. It’s completely different. Or rodeo or any of the other things.

01:35:36,470	The special use permit process. My next question. When you apply for that, who makes the initial decision is that staff such as You were then, or does it always come before the board? This, we, we, we have to, we take the application and we review it and everything is correct and we have to present them.

01:36:02,130	We cannot deny the application. It has to be this this will be presented to this board. It’s why we allow that’s why we presented the corn maze. That’s why we presented another one on, on, uh, event center, um. Earlier this year we presented them.

01:36:23,330	It’s up to this board, their recommendations that go to the county board for the final approval. So it’s, it’s not our, we do not have the authority to deny a permit. Because it doesn’t fit. Because what? I’m sorry. Because it doesn’t fit into our ordinances. Mr. Chair, Comm. Bittner. Thanks, I wanna, I wanna add a little bit more to what Mitch just said.

01:36:48,130	Um, because actually I called him on that issue. Um, about why are we hearing uh uh the permit or special use permit application when we don’t have an ordinance that allows for it. And he did clarify that staff is not allowed. I’m just agreeing with him that staff is not allowed to make those decisions.

01:37:07,700	Um, it needs to come before, first of all, the planning and zoning commission. And then if it passes out of planning and zoning commission, we go to the county commission. So there’s a separation there so that staff is not making an arbitrary decision to just, uh, deny something without seeing the light of day. Thank you.

01:37:26,300	So every tier 3. Specialist permit request would go through that process and then there would be all those waiting periods and public hearing notices and all of that then that’s correct, yes. OK, thank you. Um, so I am.

01:37:49,500	All for predicting neighbors, for sure, and the peace and tranquility that they desire living in the country, and I do not want to commercialize Agland in any way, shape, or form. Unfortunately, I don’t have any answers to help or suggestions to make that happen with or without an ordinance, but I do feel this ordinance is confusing and was pushed through too quickly and it’s a lot of change to pursue that quickly when it affects so many

01:38:10,300	people, so. All right, thank you, Heidi. uh, any questions for Heidi before she steps away. All right, seeing none, thank you. Mm Right, if anyone else would like to speak at this public hearing, please approach the microphone. Tell us who you are and where you’re from. Good evening commissioners.

01:39:03,770	Um, I’m going to bring you up to a little different holistic view over all of this, um, then what you’re going just to what this ordinance may be, just because I’d like some clarifications on words, and my name is Carrie Deckert. Carrie, I live out between wing and taddle, but we will be doing events that will be in the ETA area through soil conservation.

01:39:23,870	And Stockmen’s Association. So my question for you are on page one. Your agriculture and recreation tier 12, the list of activities that include etc. What does that mean? Would that mean a tour between garden tours, cattle tours, um, any livestock tours out there since it’s not explicitly listed.

01:39:52,130	Would it fall outside the regulation? Um, etc. is usually not used in law because of ambiguity that’s associated with it. So that is one item I would like clarification on. Um, the second one. is on page 3. Agriculture recreation, Tier 2, tier 3, number 8. Um, how would that 100 ft setback from adjacent properties will apply to a pasture tour.

01:40:21,930	Or to A garden tour that our soil conservation district does. That’s along that. Um, that is a question for you that I would love to know. Um, another one on page 3 in agriculture recreation tier 2, tier 3, number 11, one-time events. May not necessarily be able to comply with the automobile parking requirement.

01:40:49,630	And so that’s a concern because being on the Stockman’s tour, they come with two Harlow buses, multiple of cars. They’re usually only a one hour event. But it can be anywhere from 150 people to 250 people depending on the tour and there’s always some trail late. So how does that get affected? Mr. Chair. Uh, yes, Comm. Bittner. Well, that was a number of questions.

01:41:19,200	Oh, I think in general the, the first concern I had was, I think you mentioned something about the ETA. On these ordinances would not apply in the ETA. And my understanding, just in general farm tours and things like you’re talking about is similar to water tours as commissioners, you know, we get invitations to those things

01:41:39,400	and I’m not, I’m not aware of that being a commercial. Uh, events. I understand it’s related to agriculture and the whole thing, but it’s not where people are being charged to attend those things for entertainment or recreation. Does that make sense? Yes, it does. Thank you. Yeah, welcome.

01:42:02,070	Um, but how about that 100 ft setback from adjacent properties rule? Uh, say that again? I’m sorry. Um, page 3, your agriculture recreation and tier 2, tier 3, number 8. That 100 ft setback from adjacent properties rule. Does it apply to a pasture to, for example.

01:42:32,670	Right, I, I this is also in counties that, um, are also townships that no longer have their township officers or they’re planning and zoning so that will be the concern. Right, um, The setback thing is not something I’m comfortable with because I think that takes away people’s rights to use their land up to their property lines. So I’m not particularly uh satisfied with that setback thing myself, um.

01:42:52,330	But I think that setback came into play simply because of the uh the correlation between the corn maze and the deer farm next door. And that’s probably why it’s in there. OK. yeah, Comm. Munsen. Uh, to also answer your question. You’re looking at an educational session.

01:43:22,330	So that falls into tier one, so the 100 ft setback in tier 23 doesn’t apply because you’re the, the items you’ve talked about are all educational tours. That is all tier one. OK. So I understand it, OK, so how about even your parking? Again, Since is that still tier one? All of those items are in recreational tier 2, tier 3, not tier 1. OK.

01:43:50,700	And have any of the commissioners, um, visited with one of our well-known. Um, entities that has their own township, has their own zoning, like the back Blackley ranch. To see how things are going out there and how the dust control is taken care of.

01:44:12,900	How do the neighbors respond? Um, I just think that would be something very instrumental for the commission to look at when we have such a great entity right in Burley County. That is ecotourism, is commercial, can answer a lot of questions of what you all have. So I would challenge you all to do that also, but I do really feel that this wording.

01:44:35,800	I Beyond ambiguous on so many situations I have for every page from page 1 to page 4 of questions for you all. So I am definitely against. The way this is. Is there any questions? Any questions for Carrie? Seeing none, thank you. Thank you. If anyone else would like to speak in this public hearing, please approach the microphone.

01:45:35,170	Let us know who you are, where are you from? Good evening, commissioners. Um, I’m Jamie Schert, and I’m a resident of Baldwin, uh, property owner close to this corn maze, um, I just mostly wanted to get up here.

01:45:53,730	I did write a letter to you guys, but also just to show that I am opposed to the ordinance, especially as it is written right now, there’s way too much confusion and restriction, I feel, um, with it and it’s interesting. I feel that Comm. Bitner just mentioned that that number 10 Wherever that is, as far as the 100 ft setback, all of those lists were those based upon just this corn maize situation for now used for like the general public or the general.

01:46:17,330	Use of this ordinance or ordinance to be put in place was. It based around that one situation that’s taking place right now to affect all other sorts of events that maybe wanted to be um conducted under these ordinances. Um, but that’s all I really have to say most Mr.

01:46:37,230	Dunton over there took a lot of the words out of my mouth tonight, um, in regards to the ordinance and I just wanted to get up here and say I’m opposed to it. Yeah Any questions for Jamie? All right, seeing none, thank you. If anyone else would like to speak in this public hearing, please approach the microphone.

01:47:39,400	OK Good evening, uh, planning and zoning commissioners, uh, Chair Agnew. So I guess I don’t have a whole lot here. There’s a. Couple of things that I wanted to, if I could just cut you off a second, uh, your name and where you’re from Dave Layman, um, lived just north of Bismarck, uh, Burt Creek Farm.

01:48:00,800	So, um, I just kind of wanted to start out, you know, a lot of these the things in this ordinance have already been covered. Um, I’m opposed to it. I don’t think that it’s. I think it’s been fairly hastily uh written uh not real well thought out. Um, there’s a couple of points on there.

01:48:25,800	There’s one that uh uh first page section 28, um. It says that all persons, entities or organizations wishing to establish the use of egg recreation within Burleigh. County must apply for and be granted a special use permit.

01:48:47,200	So this is essentially applies that even egg wreck tier one would require a special use permit. So if anything does get uh. Captured from this document that’s maybe something to look at. Uh, another thing in this is. That the um recreational use must be ancillary to a primary egg use. So you’re essentially requiring that the owner of this property. Uh, has to drive 51% of their income from that, uh, property.

01:49:22,170	Does this make sense, you know? Can farmers get a start. You know, do they have to give up her day job to be able to be an entrepreneur. Um, So that was one of the, one of the issues there. Um, Another is, it’s been mentioned that. With um. With respect to To uh.

01:49:57,730	Apples or you pick operations that, you know, it’s illegal to have somebody come out and. And pick apples, um. I guess I would, I would kind of question, question that, um, you know, is, is that. Is that legal? You know, can the county limit? Direct marketing of egg commodities.

01:50:23,230	Um, If I’ve got 100 hay bales, or, you know,,, 1000 hay bales, 1000 bushels of grain or 1000 bushels of apples to sell. There’s really no difference. They’re all egg commodities. Um, can I now not sell hay bales or grain out of my farm.

01:50:47,430	Um, North Dakota Century code states that a um Board of County commissioners may not prohibit or prevent the use of land or buildings for farming, ranching, and may not prohibit or prevent any of the normal incidents of farming or ranching. Um, I would contend that selling your commodities is probably an important part of uh of farming and ranching. Um, it goes on to state that the Board of County commissioners may not prohibit the reasonable diversification.

01:51:13,300	Or expansion of a farming or ranching operation. Um, That’s left up to interpretation as far as what that diversification is. So the definition that they give of farming and ranching in this section is defined as cultivating land for the production of egg crops or livestock or raising, feeding or producing livestock, poultry, milk or fruit, which is what

01:51:37,800	your Yup picks are. There’s no mention of income requirements. So why then is the county. Requiring 51% of household income from that, um, come from egg operation. Um, you know, we’re talking about 75 people a day. This over 30 instances it comes out to a little over 2000 people a year. We have Operations in.

01:52:12,470	More highly populated areas. That are bringing in 500,000 to 100,000 people. A year. On 40 acre parcels on gravel. What you guys are looking at is 2 to 4%. Of what these larger operators are doing. Does that make sense? Um. When we look at page 3.

01:52:49,070	A 2, it’s talking about the 40 acre Article 11 already defines that is a 10 acre. Um, Be a one. so if we change that to 40, um, are we further restricting property rights? Um, Page 34, essentially we’re saying that events or activities shall not involve the use of permanent structures. So somebody has a barn out there, they can’t use it.

01:53:21,630	Um, why is the setback 100 ft? Bismarck allows. Up to 75 people, I think with no setback, no additional setback requirements and up to 250 with a 50 ft setback. Why is the county? Further restricting it. Over what Bismarck is. So, and then there’s a couple of other. Thoughts that I had had.

01:53:47,330	You know, we’re saying that, you know, we can’t hear a special. Use permit because there’s no ordinance for it. Why was Burnt Creek Farm. Allowed to run through this process. Denied Hell, I even pulled uh my application. You guys still had a public hearing on it. So You guys are pretty excited. To hear that, special use permit.

01:54:22,700	Why is The corn maze being denied. That same opportunity. You know, why do we change the Change the rules here. So I guess that’s about all I’ve got. If anybody’s got any questions. All right, are there any questions for Dave? See you then. Thank you. Thanks. Anyone else would like to speak at this public hearing, uh, please approach the mic.

01:54:56,270	Let us know who you are and where are you from. Girli north of Bismarck up there by Dave. Jesus went forever. I got a. Football draft to get to. Couple of things.

01:55:29,170	There’s a lot of hearsay floating around here and I know the uh state’s attorney’s office isn’t here tonight and there’s been sea she she said he said, uh, illegal to pick potatoes or apples and everything else, you know, I think we’ve really gone down. This started 15 months ago with Dave’s Bart Creek Farm.

01:55:45,470	Uh What came out of that is uh we decided we were going to get together as stakeholders and try to come up with an ordinance because the thing was sitting there for 2 years, right? I think everybody here remembers that. So here we are, where there’s a lot of folks coming to the party and they’re coming to the party late, OK, so I’m not here to say that I support or disagree with the ordinance.

01:56:02,530	We started a process of trying to write an ordinance for Burleigh County and taking it down the road to take care of both sides. Two drafts were started, Mitch. Added a third one. The thought. Was To incorporate the folks, the corn maze, the big events, right? We have a country fest over in Morton County.

01:56:24,130	There’s big events that take place and I don’t think anybody sitting in this room as opposed to agritourism or agriculture at all. I’m not, I’m a farmer rancher, OK? So, but I do live up there on 110th where Dave wanted to have his wedding venue, right? He moves in, buys a place, decides he’s going to have a wedding venue. I know he calls it an apple orchard.

01:56:43,230	That’s all good. But the bottom line is we all know what was really going on there, OK? And that’s how this all started, and that’s The opposition came all of a sudden now we’re out there opposing corn mazes and all this other stuff that’s going on, OK? I don’t think anybody in here is opposing

01:57:01,000	agriculture as it sits in the state of North Dakota. OK, so however we gotta go forward to redefine. Mary, you offered it up at 2 or 3 stakeholder meetings that you would write this thing, you would write it, you offered it up.

01:57:18,600	We took a shot, get your constituents, write it and let’s get back to this board again here. Let’s let’s have another meeting. Let’s do it, OK? Uh, I mean that’s kind of where it’s gotten to, right? I mean, we got a lot of sharpshooters off the couch. OK, people make a noise and KFYR people making noise all over the place that have never been here.

01:57:38,700	Never came to one of the meetings. Don’t know the background, don’t know anything. Yeah For a second there I thought we had CNN here, but we don’t, OK? It’s, it’s crazy. Come to the meetings, get the facts, obviously we have a lot of opposition with the ordinance, right? So there, there does need to be some clarification.

01:58:01,700	OK, so we, we ran down, I would call a rabbit hole, but tonight I’ll call it a cornwall, OK? So I think we’ll just leave it there. That’s my opinion. Obviously it needs to be some clarification and I know Mary and her group are gonna take care of that for us.

01:58:18,700	Thank you, before you, uh, step away, Kurt, uh, any questions for Curt? of my stakeholders You know that. All that 16 months ago, but yeah, we will continue on. See you, no questions. Thank you. If anyone else would like to speak at this hearing, please approach the microphone.

01:58:58,370	If anyone else would like to speak at this public hearing, please do. Right? This will be the last call for anyone who is interested in speaking at this public hearing. Uh, please approach the microphone if you. Cho Absolutely.

01:59:28,370	We, I, I think, I think we have, uh, exhausted everyone who wanted to speak, so yes, if anyone wants to come up again and uh and uh go feel free, uh, please introduce yourself and tell us where you’re from. So once again, I’m Marie Horning. I do live in Apple Creek. No, this ordinance will not harm me in Apple Creek, but I won’t land in other places in Burley County. So it could potentially harm me at some point.

01:59:45,070	Um, He laughed, but and he said some of us weren’t at meetings and stuff. I didn’t know how to become a stakeholder, didn’t know you guys were having meetings and no, I don’t show up to your meetings, but I’ve watched every single one. Um, watch every single county commission meeting.

02:00:04,030	I watch almost all the school board meetings anyway beside the point, so sometimes you’re not here because you have kids or other things, but. You might still be informed. Um, one thing I questioned. That I wrote down at the top of my thing is, is there somewhere else in the Ordinance book cause it’s 250 some pages long, where commercial recreation is defined.

02:00:27,330	I didn’t bring a laptop, so I couldn’t search. But anyway, and we don’t have to know that now, but that might be something to think about if it’s not defined somewhere else, it maybe should be defined here because that term is used a couple of times, commercial recreation, um, and then you, because you guys are are defining in this.

02:00:48,030	Um Section, what agriculture recreation is, uh, Mitch, do you have that, Mr. Chair, uh, commercial, uh, uh, recreation group is defined as a used in a commercial recreation groups is one which the principal activity is the furnishing of recreation for a profit.

02:01:11,000	And for which the following factors are present, the activity is not operated by a government agency. The following uses are declared to be in a commercial recreation group, bowling alley dance hall. Paul and build your parlor rolling skater rink, sports arena, theater bar, saloon, miniature golf. These, um, These are somewhat dated. Our ordinances are, are dated, but they give you an idea of what would be considered a commercial recreation.

02:01:36,500	I would question that’s called a commercial recreation group. And so I know on your ordinance you have many different groups and those are defined, but like in it’d be page one. Once again, I don’t know if I’m using the 3rd or the 2nd version at this point, but way down under agricultural recreation Tier 1, section the number 2.

02:01:57,770	Wherever that appears on yours, it says. With commercial recreation activity. So it doesn’t say. Commercial recreation group, so I think as a user. Of your ordinance book, I wouldn’t know to go look at group because group’s not there. So maybe you just need to add the word group after every time you use commercial recreation.

02:02:21,370	Maybe that’s the answer. So if you’re fixing this ordinance tonight like after the public hearing. You might want to do that. It might be a really easy way to get it defined, but I don’t really know if the word group works there either. So anyway, yeah. That’s kind of my comments.

02:02:37,270	Thank you for letting me speak again. Any questions for Marie before she steps away? Yeah, Comm. Connelly. Not a question, but clarification because like you said you listen to a lot of meetings and a lot of different groups.

02:02:55,230	Um, when it comes to open meeting and things when you say can I be allowed to speak again and things on any open meeting per Robert’s rules, that’s at the sole discretion of the chair, so as long as Comm. Agnew says, yeah, then it’s there. So if you walk into other meetings and you’re a little frustrated, you kind of know where that comes from.

02:03:10,530	Um, and that’s as well as like the time limits and those type of things unless one of the other people um call for like a point of order and state a reason why they would want that person, and then it would fall back again to where consensus would be asked for.

02:03:27,830	Yeah, the reason I asked is because when you speak at the Bismarck Public School District, they limit you to 3, and they do not want you to speak a second time. Yep, yep, and that’s why I clarify the question of the chairperson.

02:03:45,830	That’s why I clarified because from one meeting to another and a lot of us are on several, um, it can get very confusing and then the tensions rise and it gets harder. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you, Comm.. If anyone else would like to speak at this public hearing. Please approach the mic, tell us who you are, where you’re from. The hands on again, Bismarck, um, Thank you for clarifying, um. Just to follow up on some of the. And I’m, I’m glad you.

02:04:25,100	Made me wait, um, so I could hear some of the other comments from the other, um, people that wanted to speak. So as far as the ordinance, and I don’t know, to me it seems clear that it probably needs a little work, but, um, It doesn’t state.

02:04:42,700	And they did kind of read it quickly. Nowhere in here does it state anything about for profit, am I right? or does it state in here that it has to be for profit activity. Um Mr. Chair, is the uh the commercial recreation.

02:05:08,970	I, well, it’s defined in in the commercial recreation group as an activity that that you’re taking profit from. So it’s I mean, I could, I could, we could add a definition of commercial if you want, but it’s fairly a simple concept that if you’re making a business transaction. A profit for profit to a complete stranger to come on your property. For an activity That could be considered commercial.

02:05:33,070	So is it agricultural or is it commercial? It is a little confusing. So as far as the. The whole issue today. If it comes down to. A free will donation. Then what happens. People are making the choice. You’re not charging anybody.

02:06:01,830	And the last item I wanted to point out is, um, the lady that had some concerns with their bus tours and things that they do, um. I apologize, one of you had stated that it would fall under the tier one, but from my understanding, they still would have to apply for it, so they just somebody wants to have a tour. They don’t, they don’t have to apply for it. OK.

02:06:22,630	So if it’s agricultural recreation, but it’s tier one. It does not require a special use permit. OK. Primarily possessed for education. OK, so there’s no, OK. That might be. A little confusing as well as. It’s looked to. Make improvements, I guess, and that’s all I had. All right, any questions for Diane? Seeing none. Thank you. Thank you.

02:06:55,100	If anyone would like to speak at this public hearing, please approach the mic, tell us who you are, where you’re from. Anyone liking to speak at this public hearing. Heather Lang from Sterling, representing Berleconi Farm Bureau again. So, on that note of what she just asked, we say that tier one is education purposes only.

02:07:32,600	And we don’t have to apply for a permit? Why are we limiting to 50 people a day. Because if I’m bringing bus tours out. Stockman’s or whoever else, likely those are more than 50 people a day. So I don’t understand, again, the restrictions. The Thank you, Mr. Chair, the, the educational activities are not restricted to a number of people.

02:08:07,100	OK, because that’s because that’s number one under under tier one, correct. OK Yeah. Well OK, so I’m sorry if it’s not, but when I read this. On Page one where it says agriculture, recreation tier number one, and then you have 1, number 2. And at the bottom of 2, that’s highlighted, it says 50 people per day.

02:08:33,500	So does that number 2 not fall underneath tier one? Is that what we’re saying? No, there’s 22 items for tier 11 is the education, which is a separate section. That doesn’t list the number of people, the tier one, the second section is for your agricultural recreation activities like a corn mace or a.

02:08:59,170	Uh, hayrides That’s, that’s different than an educational purpose. OK, so can I do a you pick and, um, have education? And then I follow tier one and I don’t have to apply for a permit? And it doesn’t limit the amount of people that I have, there are, there are, there are, I’m sorry, Mr. Cha.

02:09:16,570	There are activities that are allowed in agriculture like truck farming. That’s an absolute right. It’s we do, you don’t need a permit from that. But if you’re, you’re, you know, if you’re doing it everyday event for more than 30 days or 30 days or whatever that’s going you’re charging people to come on your property.

02:09:37,670	To enter your property, not to pick something and pay for it, but come on your property for an activity. It’s considered recreation. It’s, you know, that’s what the intent of this ordinance is, is not to suppress agricultural activities. That are an everyday event that are affecting the neighbors that are affecting the roads, they’re affecting, um.

02:10:02,730	Complaint based origins from, from the navy. That’s what this ordinance is all about. So there are, there are activities that are allowed by uh, absolutely. It’s truck farming is one of them. And I, and I do hear you say that, so this time, the first time I came up I asked for clarification on what regular basis means.

02:10:22,830	This time you said an everyday basis. Um, so again with the wording, I just get confused and I have been at the stakeholders’ meetings. And I’ve noticed that. A lot of the wording that you say, Mitch says things to the effect of we don’t want to.

02:10:47,930	Um, infringe on agritourism or you don’t want to affect anything currently out there. But yet, uh. Then you come back and you say, as long as the neighbors don’t disagree. Then we’re OK. As, as was discussed, Mr. Chaz was discussed earlier. The reason why we’re here is because of the neighbors. They didn’t want these activities near them. And we get put in the middle.

02:11:13,800	Burley County gets Burley County is commission, the county board gets foot in the middle between those. And that’s what this ordinance is the direction of this ordinance, the intent is to prevent that from happening. To allow it, but to bring everybody to the table. To discuss the differences.

02:11:34,900	Yep, and I, and I agree with, um, whoever had stated that, you know, if you do a stakeholders meeting, from here on out that, you know, you look at maybe inviting some other people and I know that there have been a lot of people invited to the stakeholders meeting, since I do get all those, I know that there have been a lot invited that don’t

02:11:48,500	show up. So I do, um, understand that. I just want to make sure that we have everybody from both sides on there, so I appreciate that. We had an email list of 48 people. I know it’s considerable for a stakeh. group. I get it, thank you.

02:12:04,870	Not, not that I don’t want more people. I, I would love to have more people there because you get more people, you get more ideas. But it’s You know, we’re just trying to wade through this as best we can. OK. All right. Any, any questions for Heather? So no, thank you.

02:12:29,670	If anyone else would like to speak at this public hearing, uh, please come to the mic, tell us who you are and where you’re from. Oh boy Well, I’m Justin Decker, I’m from Marina, um. Um My township doesn’t fall under this, uh, we’re in Harriet Lee Township. But I am member of the Burleigh County Township Officers Association.

02:13:16,130	From, um, I’m feeling that a lot of this it falls under property rights. Um, I’ve owned property or. Been on my property for over 60 years. We do what we need to do to make a living. And uh. If you’re trying to limit all this on account of the, the dust on the road.

02:13:43,030	Well, anybody that’s lived out on these properties knew they were living by a gravel road. If they didn’t and when you’re living by a gravel road, there’s gonna be some dust, yeah, sometimes it’s worse than others, but. That’s just part of living out in the country. And you don’t always control, you know, they say the pristine country living.

02:14:07,100	It’s not always so pristine out there. There’s lots of things that happen out there that disturb me. I’ve got neighbors. I hear their dogs barking. I don’t complain about it. Because that’s just part of living where I live. You got to understand that. You know, you, it just something. Um, we’re not living in town.

02:14:31,000	Living in town is a whole different set of rules. But Um, that’s why I really have a problem with this ordinance. Uh, some of this stuff, if you have an event, you’re going to do the best you can to take care of whoever’s there. I don’t even a family event.

02:14:52,270	You know, you, you, you do the best you can and you don’t know how many people are going to show up. I don’t eat that corn maze. They can’t tell you how many people are going to show up like they say it’s weather, everything. I mean, any event you have, you don’t know how many people are going to show up.

02:15:07,370	You, you can even have RSVP. How many, you know, there’s only a certain percentage of them show up even when they RSVP so to set a. Different number, you know, a limit of people are going to show up. You can’t do that. I, or I can’t see how you can do that.

02:15:24,470	And like one said, you know, if you get 251 people there? Are you supposed to kick out that one that’s not show, you know, that showed up late to the party. That’s, uh, I guess that’s my feelings on it. Anybody have questions? All right, any questions for Justin? Seeing none. Thank you.

02:15:57,130	If anyone else would like to speak at this public hearing. Please approach the mic and uh do so. Introduce yourself and tell us where you’re from. If anyone else would like to speak at this public hearing, uh, please approach the mic. Alright, this will be the last call for anyone who would like to speak at this public hearing? All right, seeing none, um.

02:16:35,530	Let’s see we. We have, before we close the public hearing, I guess I will ask, is there anyone who? Has any need to continue this public hearing. OK. Hearing none, we will close the public hearing. And move into uh discussion and action on.

02:17:11,300	The amendment to Burley County zoning ordinance, Article 8 special uses, 20 section 28, agricultural recreation, um, amendment including Article 3 definitions, Article 11, a agricultural district regulations, Section 3 permitted uses and Section 4 special uses. Is there any discussion? Uh Yeah, Comm. Connelly.

02:17:43,800	Um, the term commercial came up a couple of times and I just, uh, it’s more of a statewide concern and there was a lot of um When people are trying to make their point they. Talk about it and they state extremes where you can kind of read into the extremes. Um, I, I’ve talked to a lot of people in Burley County, um, as well as Bismarck and things and the consensus is is we don’t want a Campbell farms.

02:18:02,400	We don’t want what happened up in Grand Forks. We don’t want that to be part of the discussion and one thing that might be considered just if I, uh, Jack in the Box idea, so to speak, is is that if, say, at the county commission, you had 3 commissioners.

02:18:24,600	Vote, um, to turn that conversation over to a referendum vote on an election year. That means they were anybody coming in from, say, Amazon, if all of a sudden they want to get in the corn maids business. They could only do it once every other year, and it would have to be at the consensus of the entire county.

02:18:42,600	Yeah, that could be something that could be considered because then all of these discussions and the reason why we’re here today with that element taken off the table, we could be addressing this finite issue that’s within the scope of the people that we all live nearby. As an example, Right, is there any further discussion? Uh, Mr. Chair. Yes, Comm. Bittner. Thank you.

02:19:05,570	Um, there’s a couple of things for clarification. I believe back when we started this process, we directed staff to have what we’re calling stakeholder meetings, right? And I, and I don’t think we gave any limitation. And who could attend those, uh, I don’t believe there was any exclusion. Of anybody.

02:19:28,070	Right, uh, Mitch is that correct? That’s correct, uh Mr. Fisher. OK. So Whether or not, I mean this, all of these meetings are publicized, so whether or not anybody had an opportunity to participate as a stakeholder. That’s kind of a moot point. But What I would suggest is we discontinue the use of the word stakeholder group. Because I don’t think that’s the correct thing.

02:19:50,430	I think if anything we need a focus group that can take the concept and develop ordinances around it so that maybe it’s less confrontational. Um, because it appears that there’s two sides, there are more than two sides, but there’s two main sides to this.

02:20:10,730	People are for it or against it, and apparently you’re against it if you didn’t get your way in the stakeholder meetings. So I think that we need to change that. And uh realistically based on all the testimony here tonight, I don’t see any way that we can move forward with uh approving this cause I don’t think a few minor tweaks that we would normally do at a

02:20:25,930	planning commission meeting is going to be sufficient to address the concerns that heard tonight. Thank you. Uh, yes, any further discussion, uh, Comm. Rusch. Uh, thank you, Mr. Chair.

02:20:43,930	Clearly this isn’t ready for prime time, and I don’t think we as a group should try and go through it and rewrite it tonight, it would take forever and it wouldn’t turn out right anyway, so I’ll, I’ll make a motion to table. We, uh, I, I, uh, I’ll just.

02:21:02,400	Before anyone seconds that, I will tell you that uh this is a public hearing we have to take action on this to either approve or deny as I, as I understand it, is that correct, Mitch? I don’t believe we can table a. Action coming out of a public hearing. On a public hearing, you have to. Have an action that’s completed. If this was a public meeting, we could just take conversation, but we have to, you have to decide something. Uh yes I’m gonna say no to the uh.

02:21:29,800	I’ll withdraw my earlier motion first. Oh, I was gonna say actually, uh, the, the motion would die due to lack of second. Um, it has now been moved to. Can you restate your motion proceed at this time. All right, so it has been moved and seconded to deny the uh.

02:21:54,970	The ordinance to amend the the Burleigh County Zoning Ordinance, uh, Article 8, Special uses Section 28, agricultural recreation, the article with along with Article 3 and Article 11, uh, with the Mr. Chair. Yes, a little bit of conversation here before we we vote. Um, first off, I support the motion.

02:22:16,370	Um, because I, I don’t think, um, based on these comments that we’re ready to move forward with the ordinance, but I wanted to caution. Um, that By, by taking this action. It’s very clear to me based on the direction the, the, the direction from the county state’s attorney. That, uh, there will be no special use permits. Um, for these various things like Burt Creek farms, like.

02:22:42,570	Um, the, uh, the, the corn maze at Baldwin Greenhouse, so just so that we’re all clear. We don’t have a mechanism for that to move forward by denying this, so. Saying that I’m gonna, I’m gonna support the motion. Thank you. Thank you. Uh, any further discussion? Uh, yes, Comm. Sreififel.

02:23:02,530	I’m wondering if, uh, I also support the motion. I, I believe that we’re not in a place where we can move forward with what we have in front of us, but I, I would like to thank the people who spent their time on what we’ve been calling the stakeholder meetings, and I agree with Comm.

02:23:18,430	Bittner that a focus group would be a better idea as we move forward, but I’m wondering if we can simply add egg tourism or ag recreation as Section 22 under Article 8. And then every special use permit that comes in regarding ag tourism could be looked at as its own entity like, um, they apply for a special use permit.

02:23:40,230	Here’s what they want to do, um, neighbors can come forth with whatever, so it would simply be an egg. Tourism Number 22 under that section. I think we’re at 21. Under section under Article 11. So I’m wondering if that’s a possibility.

02:24:02,400	And then, and then treating those on a case by case basis is what it’s kind of, for example, restricting the corn maze if it wasn’t beside a wild deer farmer or, you know, if it, if there was a better infrastructure for a certain, um, Let’s say like the Burn Creek Farm is there’s better infrastructure surrounding it where there wasn’t a one-way in, one way out kind of thing.

02:24:22,100	If each thing could be treated as its own special use permit application, all addressed under It’s tourism. It’s just a thought, OK. Mr. Chair, oh yes, Comm. Bittner. I think that’s a valid input there. I, I think that um that’s another way to look at it that we really should consider that they could.

02:24:48,100	Yeah, uh, any additional discussion, uh, I’m gonna go to Comm. Connelly. Um, just for clarification on the stakeholder and um our focus group or what um. More so for Marla because we discussed it, um, two of us commissioners are fairly new at this and that, um, interactions between an open meeting group say because um the one gal that came up here,

02:25:12,370	uh, she asked, why aren’t we in those meetings and there’s a certain um. Thing that we have to be aware of when it comes to those um meetings. Yeah right, I, I can speak to that a little. Oh, go ahead, Mr. Munsen. Go ahead, Comm. Munson. I just wanted to respond.

02:25:32,670	I know the uh Comm. Streifel and I were in, I did miss one, but we were in a lot of those stakeholder meetings so that we could. Try to keep this process moving forward. All right. Any further discussion, uh, Comm.

02:25:51,130	Risch? The only point I want to make is, um, Tom Dutton here from Minoan made I thought an excellent point and what he said essentially said was if we don’t have an ordinance prohibiting something, it’s probably allowable, and I, I understand the state’s attorney is saying otherwise, but there’s all kinds of things people do in life that is not exactly a rule against, and they do it.

02:26:08,430	So I don’t know that we have to write a rule to OK everything in life. Uh, I’m not a big rules Guy. I’m a big property rights Guy, and it seems to me. If we don’t, if we just. Uh, postpone this. I, I think some of my activities can happen because they’re not against the law.

02:26:27,830	No, I, I’m not a lawyer. I’ll yes, Comm. Bittner, go ahead. Yeah, we’re, um, as Burley County commission, we’re obligated to follow our um advice from legal counsel. Um, when the state’s attorney advises us to take a certain action, taking a different action would certainly put us at risk.

02:26:46,130	And I realized that you’ve been on a commission a short time. Mr. Risch, but Um, You got to really pay attention to the attorney’s advice because they keep us out of court, you know. And, and with if it’s, it’s a long standing practice in law and as it relates to zoning ordinances.

02:27:09,500	That a lot of us would rather be able to do whatever we want on our land. But these things are pretty well established. This is nothing new. Thank you. Thank you. Uh, any further discussion? Uh yeah, Comm. Connelly.

02:27:32,600	So just for clarification, so it’s on tape and everybody knows if they’re say at the focus group and things if there’s more than quorum that shows up at this table, that’s what I was trying to get at is because there’s very specific things when something like that happens. Yes, thank you, thank you for that clarification.

02:27:52,400	Yes, I, I can add to that too, having been involved in a lot of those, as long as we’re not appointing members, um, to act as representatives of the board, whether it’s a planning commission or the county commission or whatever, then it doesn’t fall under the same kind of rules. Um, if a quorum of commissioners isn’t, is going to show up as strongly recommend public notice. Um, and so as commissioners, if you intend to attend those uh focus group meetings.

02:28:13,600	Please advise staff so that they can um Uh, initiate the appropriate public notice. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Bitner. That’s exactly why I asked, so yeah. Appreciate that. Thank you for the reminder.

02:28:31,000	uh, I guess, you know, in, in my, in my head, I’m, I’m kind of thinking about this a little bit of why, why did we go down this, this road. A lot of it is to try to bridge that gap between the egg piece and the commercial piece, and the reason that we don’t want to necessarily push these things to rezoning to commercial is that we don’t want to, I guess, as, as much as as as the staff

02:28:46,200	kind of says is that we don’t want a hopscotch, uh, these, these pieces where we just have these commercial post ex postage stamps kind of Popping up all over, uh, and that was a lot of why we ended up going down this side, and as much, I mean, I hate to throw the sworddinance out because there

02:29:02,470	has been a tremendous amount of hours and effort put into this, um, I, I would agree with you, uh, Comm. Risch not ready for prime time, uh, but really it’s, it’s, uh, you know, where, where do we go from here? I think, uh, you know, a good idea would be going into that

02:29:18,270	that what is a special use, um, we still do have the PUD route that is. An easy route for people to go uh on this where we just do a rezone into a PUD, explain what you’re going to do, and uh and and you’re covered, so I, I really as much as all

02:29:34,270	the work that we’ve put into this, I really think we’re doing the right thing by not not rushing into this, not really taking this, uh, taking this farther, uh, but I, I think there are opportunities out there already.

02:29:52,730	But I think the the piece of potentially looking at that and I don’t know Mitch Marla, um, how we would go about that of potentially looking at that, that adding that. Something into, especially into the the additional special uses that we do have, um. I’m not sure if that’s the best route or not.

02:30:12,430	I think it’s a, it’s a maybe a good route to to look at, but uh I I think with the, with the PUD opportunity out there, there’s, there’s already this opportunity for all these things to, to say, hey, we’re going to rezone to a PUD, bring that to this uh to this commission.

02:30:29,530	We can, we can work it over, we can set those, uh, the what, what you’re going to do, what those acceptable pieces are, people can have their say, have their input in in hearings and that recommendation can go to the county commission. So, um. I know we’ve we’ve put a lot of time into it, but uh that’s it’s uh brought up some great discussions if nothing else, Mr. Chair, Mitch, I think that.

02:30:49,930	We could use a little assistance from the state’s attorney on some of these questions. Yes. Alright, uh, any further discussion? OK, hearing, uh, hearing none, hearing none, we will, uh. Oh We’re, oh, just a, um, we’re just gonna, we’re gonna move into a vote for the board, um, so. Yeah, well, um.

02:31:22,600	We, uh, we’ve closed the public hearing, so I just want to make sure that uh we say that the public has been heard and um and yeah, if you do have, if you do have something to eat to discuss with the commissioners, please by far, you can take that up with them. Uh, what’s, what’s the clarification? With this ruling, Is this party able to continue with their maize.

02:31:43,600	No, no. How can you rule against it if you don’t have authority over it. So if, uh, I So if, uh, I So if, uh, I So if, uh, I, I, I guess, uh So there won’t be any agricultural uh recreation, um, uh, special use uh in Article 8. Uh, with us.

02:32:03,670	So, um, Marla, if you could take us through a roll call vote. the motion is to deny the ordinance that amends Article 8. Section 28. Um, Comm. Bittner. Yes. Comm. Connelly, yes. Comm. Jarrett, yes. Comm. Munsen. Comm. Patrick. Comm. Rich. Commissionerreifel. And Mr. Chair.

02:32:53,130	7 Alright, the uh, the amendment to the Burley County uh zoning ordinance for Article 8 special uses Section 28, agricultural recreation, including amendments to Article 3 definitions. Article 11, agricultural district regulations, Section 3 permitted uses, Section 4, special uses is denied. All right, we have nothing. Oh yes.

02:33:18,230	Does this move to Berluconi Commissioners now, or does it, this is a recommendation we’re just making a recommendation, we’re making a recommendation to deny to the Burleigh County Commission. So, uh, the Burleigh County Commission still takes this up. Here’s this, so I will invite anyone if anyone would like to appeal this decision, please take that to the uh to the county commission, so. Over, over to you. Yes, yes, Comm. Munsen.

02:33:37,330	I, I don’t have anything else on the agenda on the agenda for this special meeting, uh, so if there’s a motion to adjourn. Some of. All right, it’s been moved and seconded to adjourn. Is there any opposement to adjournment? Hearing none,